When will the coaches start to hold players accountable?

[UTEopia]

Players with no accountability continue to hurt the Utes. Dres has had too many passes go off his hands and into the hands of the opposition. I know he is our only real threat, but he needs to sit for a series or two for those errors.

Wilson seems to make terrible reads without accountability. I am happy to see Shultz in and then he just throws a pick.

[LA Ute]

The o-line play has been miserable.

[Utah]

Imagine how different we would be if Dres could catch. At least one less pick in the UCLA/OSU/Stanford/USC games. That's nuts.

If Dres could catch, we might have 7 wins right now.

I thought DVC hurt this team.

[LA Ute]

Someone, somewhere, was blaming the tipped passes on Wilson's throwing motion. I think that's a real stretch. I've been trying to remember if anyone other than Dres has been tipping passes. Hasn't it mainly been him? If so, it's tough to blame Travis.

[U-Ute]

Someone, somewhere, was blaming the tipped passes on Wilson's throwing motion. I think that's a real stretch. I've been trying to remember if anyone other than Dres has been tipping passes. Hasn't it mainly been him? If so, it's tough to blame Travis.

Dres's diminutive stature could be playing into it. But I don't think it is only him. A number lot of Wilson's throws have been high lately. There were 2-3 other throws yesterday, to other receivers than Dres, which were thrown high and off of the receivers hands which could've easily turned into interceptions.

Is Wilson worried about his throws getting tipped at the line and adjusting too much? Only he knows.

[U-Ute]

The o-line play has been miserable.

This. I don't know how much the loss of Murphy is playing into this, but they have been terrible the last two games.

[NorthwestUteFan]

This. I don't know how much the loss of Murphy is playing into this, but they have been terrible the last two games.

I think John White covered up a lot of poor line play. How many times did we see some LB, DE, or Corner blast through the line untouched only to get lit up by the diminutive JWIV?

Our last beast at LT was Cullen. We could certainly use him now. Despite his two False start penalties per game, he was solid and only rarely got beat on a play. Our current LT gets beat on pass protection at least five times PER QUARTER.

The O line has been very underwhelming since Tim Davis left, despite having very good talent.

K Whitt needs to seriously evaluate his entire staff and cut out the underperforming units (I'm looking squarely at Roderick, Finn, Shah, Hill, perhaps BJ and Scalley, and even Sitake.). Dennis Erickson is the only person on staff who absolutely MUST come back next year. All the others need to earn their way back into the fans' good graces.

[justaute]

At the beginning of the season, our coaches said the o-line should be a strength of the team. These are a few of the questions I have.

- Did we have injuries?
- Are the coaches' abilities to make proper assessment just sub-par?
- Whit is a very good coach. He's a terrific D coach. Is he just not a very good head-coach? (offense sucked since 2008 and Sitake is not a very good D-coordinator IMO)

[UTEopia]

Dres's diminutive stature could be playing into it. But I don't think it is only him. A number lot of Wilson's throws have been high lately. There were 2-3 other throws yesterday, to other receivers than Dres, which were thrown high and off of the receivers hands which could've easily turned into interceptions.

Is Wilson worried about his throws getting tipped at the line and adjusting too much? Only he knows.

Dres is 6'. He is slight, but he is not short.

[UTEopia]

I think John White covered up a lot of poor line play. How many times did we see some LB, DE, or Corner blast through the line untouched only to get lit up by the diminutive JWIV?

Our last beast at LT was Cullen. We could certainly use him now. Despite his two False start penalties per game, he was solid and only rarely got beat on a play. Our current LT gets beat on pass protection at least five times PER QUARTER.

The O line has been very underwhelming since Tim Davis left, despite having very good talent.

K Whitt needs to seriously evaluate his entire staff and cut out the underperforming units (I'm looking squarely at Roderick, Finn, Shah, Hill, perhaps BJ and Scalley, and even Sitake.). Dennis Erickson is the only person on staff who absolutely MUST come back next year. All the others need to earn their way back into the fans' good graces.

You are joking about having very good OL talent, right? We are playing 5 guards. When Davis was here we had Bergstrom and Cullen at tackles, Sam Brenner at guard, Tevita Stevens at Center and either JT or Jones at the other guard. Bergstrom was all conference and Cullen was honorable mention. Brenner was a warrior. We don't have any linemen in the program as good as either Cullen or Bergstrom. I would venture that we don't currently have a lineman as good as Brenner. If we had Cullen and Bergstrom at tackles and then had Jones, Salt and Poutasi on the inside then we might have very good talent. We also had one of the best RB's to play at Utah in John White.

[Devildog]

The Utes have made some progress since we joined this league. But not enough yet.

We have got to find a way to win in the PAC 12 consistently. We absolutely need to find a way to beat Oregon State in our own house, a down Arizona team, a vulnerable USC team... Damn. We had chances and the opportunities were there... we just didn't have the horses and the coaching staff to win in the game of inches. We lose too many inches along the way.

We have to find the recruits and the coaches to win more of the individual battles that take place during the game. They all add up and we are coming up short in this tough ass league.

Still... we are here and earning our way one step at a time. I would rather be fighting and struggling through this conference than winning in a conference nobody respects. Winning here is damn difficult... but will be that much more rewarding when we get there.

Kyle better find a way to win in the PAC... and soon.

[SoCalPat]

The Utes have made some progress since we joined this league (1). But not enough yet.

We have got to find a way to win in the PAC 12 consistently. We absolutely need to find a way to beat Oregon State in our own house, a down Arizona team, a vulnerable USC team... Damn. We had chances and the opportunities were there... we just didn't have the horses and the coaching staff to win in the game of inches. We lose too many inches along the way.

We have to find the recruits and the coaches to win more of the individual battles that take place during the game. They all add up and we are coming up short in this tough ass league.

Still... we are here and earning our way one step at a time. I would rather be fighting and struggling through this conference than winning in a conference nobody respects. Winning here is damn difficult... but will be that much more rewarding when we get there (2).

Kyle better find a way to win in the PAC... and soon.

1. Name it. I'm curious. Recruiting doesn't count because that's totally subjective. Not to mention a lot of that progress came totally by default when we got into the Pac-12.

2. Utah fans need to buckle up and get used to the possibility that we're more in line with Cal, Oregon State and Arizona than we are Washington, UCLA and Stanford. That's clear now, obviously, but I'm talking about for the next 30-40 years. It's entirely possible that everyone participating in this thread will NEVER see Utah in the Rose Bowl in their lifetime. If we never get there, all the fighting and struggling becomes far less interesting, much less noble.

[sancho]

1. Name it. I'm curious. Recruiting doesn't count because that's totally subjective. Not to mention a lot of that progress came totally by default when we got into the Pac-12.

Starting 1-3 in conference play instead of 0-4 is measurable progress. Beating a top 10 team is progress. Shoot, even beating USU is progress over last year.

[SoCalPat]

Starting 1-3 in conference play instead of 0-4 is measurable progress. Beating a top 10 team is progress. Shoot, even beating USU is progress over last year.

Individually, I can't argue against the first two items. I would counter by saying is it really progress when the bar has been set low and we're barely clearing it now? I don't look at the USU victory as progress per se -- we would have beaten them last year with the home field we had this year.

What's mind-jacked our entire fanbase is something we've really never dealt with before -- how the high from wins such as Stanford can be so fleeting, so temporary. I know I've fallen into that trap -- you can find a post of mine from the offseason where I said I'd rather go 5-7 with a win over a ranked conference opponent than 6-6 with our biggest win coming against BYU. After the last two weeks, I'm not sure I believe in that anymore.

[LA Ute]

Individually, I can't argue against the first two items. I would counter by saying is it really progress when the bar has been set low and we're barely clearing it now? I don't look at the USU victory as progress per se -- we would have beaten them last year with the home field we had this year.

What's mind-jacked our entire fanbase is something we've really never dealt with before -- how the high from wins such as Stanford can be so fleeting, so temporary. I know I've fallen into that trap -- you can find a post of mine from the offseason where I said I'd rather go 5-7 with a win over a ranked conference opponent than 6-6 with our biggest win coming against BYU. After the last two weeks, I'm not sure I believe in that anymore.

Here's the question I can't answer: in our last two games, did we underperform, or were we simply exposed?

[SoCalPat]

Here's the question I can't answer: in our last two games, did we underperform, or were we simply exposed?

We don't have the leadership on this team to thrive away from home. Immature teams thrive at home, wilt on the road. We're also dealing from the bottom of the deck when it comes to personnel and injuries. We're clearly underperforming at the QB position (probably O-line as well), but we're probably where we should expect ourselves to be, all things considered. We're an average team that's capable of playing better than average, but also capable of stinking up the joint as well. We're a total wild card, especially at home.

So to answer your question, you're asking for absolutes when the truth is somewhere in between.

[UTEopia]

Here's the question I can't answer: in our last two games, did we underperform, or were we simply exposed?


I think we are at the point where we cannot do very well with a one armed or a backup QB. We need to play at our peak level offensively to win in this league and we cannot do it with a one armed Wilson or Shulz. Would we be in a better position offensively if our OL was better and our WR's faster? Yes, but they aren't going to get much better or faster the rest of this year. We do not have the OL of 2011 and a healthy John White to carry the load. I honestly believe that it is as simple as that. Now fixing the problems is a much different question. I think we are on the road at QB and OL with the current commits. I think Hatfield has great upside. Lewis is unkown. I am not sure McClellon or Allen will ever contribute much. Will the commits make a difference? I hope so.

[sancho]

Here's the question I can't answer: in our last two games, did we underperform, or were we simply exposed?

Until we have a WR/QB combo that can beat pressure, we will not be scoring much. We had it to some extent early in the season, but injuries to QBs and TEs have really hurt. The defensive coordinator against our offense has the easiest job in football right now.

Fix that one thing, and I think our offense is back in business. But I don't know how we fix it.

[Devildog]

1. Name it. I'm curious. Recruiting doesn't count because that's totally subjective. Not to mention a lot of that progress came totally by default when we got into the Pac-12.

2. Utah fans need to buckle up and get used to the possibility that we're more in line with Cal, Oregon State and Arizona than we are Washington, UCLA and Stanford. That's clear now, obviously, but I'm talking about for the next 30-40 years. It's entirely possible that everyone participating in this thread will NEVER see Utah in the Rose Bowl in their lifetime. If we never get there, all the fighting and struggling becomes far less interesting, much less noble.

Damn Pat I'm down right now too man, but Jeez dude easy with the pessimism... it's downright defeatist.

The program has come a long way since we joined the PAC. Where the hell did we think we were going to be? Did we really think we were going to just waltz in and win back to back rose bowls?

When we beat Stanford look how many of us were revising our predictions for the rest of the year... now we are revising back. We are still in the hunt for a bowl game and that is where we guessed we would be when we started... and really that would be good for this team and right on track.

We made a bowl game our first year, missed the second and should make one this year. Our recruiting (as a whole) is better than what we were getting in The Mountain West. Our facilities are much improved, we have a big signature win, our fan base continues to sell out our stadium in spite of mediocre records, We have a real O.C. now and a young but able QB (if he stops turning the damn ball over), we are generally playing everyone close...

We just need to pick up a few more plays along the way. We are seeing progress. We just need to look at the big picture instead of the immediate view right in front of us.

This team will return to a bowl this year, and we will be better next year.

[SoCalPat]

Damn Pat I'm down right now too man, but Jeez dude easy with the pessimism... it's downright defeatist (1).

The program has come a long way since we joined the PAC. Where the hell did we think we were going to be? Did we really think we were going to just waltz in and win back to back rose bowls? (2)

When we beat Stanford look how many of us were revising our predictions for the rest of the year... now we are revising back. We are still in the hunt for a bowl game and that is where we guessed we would be when we started... and really that would be good for this team and right on track.

We made a bowl game our first year, missed the second and should make one this year (3). Our recruiting (as a whole) is better than what we were getting in The Mountain West (4). Our facilities are much improved, we have a big signature win, our fan base continues to sell out our stadium in spite of mediocre records (5), We have a real O.C. now and a young but able QB (if he stops turning the damn ball over), we are generally playing everyone close...

We just need to pick up a few more plays along the way. We are seeing progress. We just need to look at the big picture instead of the immediate view right in front of us (6).

This team will return to a bowl this year, and we will be better next year.

1. Defeatism would be to stop caring. I still care. Perhaps too much.

2. You're wildly overstating my POV to try and make your point. Did you expect to start a collective 1-11 in the first half of our conference games three years in?

3. We're pinning our bowl hopes on a sizable upset (ASU) or winning at Washington State against an improved Cougar team. We very well could be underdogs in every game but Colorado. I don't think it's that definitive that we "should be" in a bowl. I think that's why the last two weeks have really hurt -- we could have possibly locked one up or been one win away.

4. This is a claim by puzzled BYU fans who can't believe they've lost to "less-talented" Utah in 9 of the last 12 meetings. Recruiting isn't better if it's not producing.

5. I am rather amazed by this. I also think it speaks well of how the fanbase perceives the product on the field and its belief in Kyle. Yes, the Pac-12 helps, but that can't override having zero faith in the coach (witness attendance in Mac's last few years). I can't believe I'm sounding like BYU Fan when I say this, but I look at our attendance as a victory of sorts this year. If we sell out CU, but win to only get to 5-7, Kyle and the staff should apologize to the entire fanbase for not having a team whose results did not match the passion of the fans.

6. I always feel better about things in the offseason. Shoot, I predicted a victory this year against Oregon of all teams. Injuries have really put a dent in what this team could accomplish and that's a shame. Media and rival fans would say that's one of those mamby-pamby excuses to try and justify a poor W-L record, but injuries are definitely a reason behind our struggles. As a whole, we're better than a .500 program, that's what you're trying to say and I'm fully on board with that. It still sucks that we're 4-4.

[NorthwestUteFan]

Oregon is one of the worst teams in the league in 4th down conversions. If we can just keep them from busting a long play for a TD on every 1st, 2nd, and 3rd down, we just might make your prediction come true.

We had best pray to the gods of good weather that the game in Pullman is warm and sunny, or else we just might need to rally to beat Colorado at home to get that 5th win.