Sullyute
01-13-2014, 11:39 AM
So in Sunday School we talked about foreordination. There were lots of comments made about foreordination of callings. The wife of a stake counselor admitted that not all callings are inspired. Then the famous JS quote was thrown out that every calling was pre-ordained in the grand council (see quote below). So the teacher ran out of time before we could really get much deeper on the topic.
So the question that I asked was what was the purpose of foreordination? If we have our agency to choose, then what is the point? If God knew what callings we were going to take and then preordained us to those callings then that seems more like pre-destiny. If he pre-ordained us to the possible calling outcomes based on our choices (college, jobs, homes, spouses, health, righteousness, etc) throughout life, then wouldn't we just be foreordained to every possible calling in the Church? That really seems like a waste of time.
Personally this seems like a 19th century doctrine to justify slavery, royalty, racism, poverty, nepotism, etc. In modern times does this doctrine really still work and what is the purpose if we really have agency?
Foreordination is the premortal selection of individuals to come forth in mortality at specified times, under certain conditions, and to fulfill predesignated responsibilities. In LDS interpretation, "foreordained" does not mean predetermined (see Predestination (http://www.lightplanet.com/mormons/daily/interfaith/predestination_eom.htm)). It is the outcome of voluntary choice, not the violation or abrogation of it.
Abraham (http://www.lightplanet.com/mormons/basic/bible/abraham.html) was told that he was included among the valiant spirits and was therefore chosen or foreordained before his birth to be a leader in God's kingdom on earth (Abr. 3:22-23). The Lord likewise informed Jeremiah, "Before I formed thee in the belly I knew thee; and…I ordained thee a prophet unto the nations" (Jer. 1:5). Alma 2 (http://www.lightplanet.com/mormons/book_of_mormon/people/alma_2.html) taught that priests belonging to a "holy order" were foreordained "according to the foreknowledge of God, on account of their exceeding faith and good works" (Alma 13:1, 3). The Prophet Joseph Smith (http://www.lightplanet.com/mormons/people/joseph_smith/index.html) concluded that "every man who has a calling to minister to the inhabitants of the world was ordained to that very purpose in the Grand Council of heaven before this world was" (TPJS, p. 365).
While each of these selections is ultimately based on the omniscience and foreknowledge of God, several factors may influence one's earthly circumstances. Foreordination comes as a blessing or reward for premortal righteousness and valiant commitment to Jesus Christ. Birth into the house of Israel and heirship to all the blessings of Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob are often seen as the birthright of dedicated souls (see Eph. 1:4-5; Rom. 9:4).
Latter-day Saints further believe that the times, places, and circumstances of birth into mortality may be the outcome of former covenants and decisions as well as that which would be best, in divine wisdom, to provide both opportunities and challenges for the individual's growth and development. Additionally, foreordination may also be based on God's own purposes and plans to bless all of his children. The specifics of these factors remain unclear. As a result, a person's premortal character can never be judged by his or her present station in life. Some of the most bitter and arduous circumstances may be, in the perspective of eternity, the most blessed, and perhaps even the situations that men and women elected and agreed to enter. Foreordination does not preclude the exercise of agency. Foreordination is a conditional preappointment to or bestowal of certain blessings and responsibilities.
So the question that I asked was what was the purpose of foreordination? If we have our agency to choose, then what is the point? If God knew what callings we were going to take and then preordained us to those callings then that seems more like pre-destiny. If he pre-ordained us to the possible calling outcomes based on our choices (college, jobs, homes, spouses, health, righteousness, etc) throughout life, then wouldn't we just be foreordained to every possible calling in the Church? That really seems like a waste of time.
Personally this seems like a 19th century doctrine to justify slavery, royalty, racism, poverty, nepotism, etc. In modern times does this doctrine really still work and what is the purpose if we really have agency?
Foreordination is the premortal selection of individuals to come forth in mortality at specified times, under certain conditions, and to fulfill predesignated responsibilities. In LDS interpretation, "foreordained" does not mean predetermined (see Predestination (http://www.lightplanet.com/mormons/daily/interfaith/predestination_eom.htm)). It is the outcome of voluntary choice, not the violation or abrogation of it.
Abraham (http://www.lightplanet.com/mormons/basic/bible/abraham.html) was told that he was included among the valiant spirits and was therefore chosen or foreordained before his birth to be a leader in God's kingdom on earth (Abr. 3:22-23). The Lord likewise informed Jeremiah, "Before I formed thee in the belly I knew thee; and…I ordained thee a prophet unto the nations" (Jer. 1:5). Alma 2 (http://www.lightplanet.com/mormons/book_of_mormon/people/alma_2.html) taught that priests belonging to a "holy order" were foreordained "according to the foreknowledge of God, on account of their exceeding faith and good works" (Alma 13:1, 3). The Prophet Joseph Smith (http://www.lightplanet.com/mormons/people/joseph_smith/index.html) concluded that "every man who has a calling to minister to the inhabitants of the world was ordained to that very purpose in the Grand Council of heaven before this world was" (TPJS, p. 365).
While each of these selections is ultimately based on the omniscience and foreknowledge of God, several factors may influence one's earthly circumstances. Foreordination comes as a blessing or reward for premortal righteousness and valiant commitment to Jesus Christ. Birth into the house of Israel and heirship to all the blessings of Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob are often seen as the birthright of dedicated souls (see Eph. 1:4-5; Rom. 9:4).
Latter-day Saints further believe that the times, places, and circumstances of birth into mortality may be the outcome of former covenants and decisions as well as that which would be best, in divine wisdom, to provide both opportunities and challenges for the individual's growth and development. Additionally, foreordination may also be based on God's own purposes and plans to bless all of his children. The specifics of these factors remain unclear. As a result, a person's premortal character can never be judged by his or her present station in life. Some of the most bitter and arduous circumstances may be, in the perspective of eternity, the most blessed, and perhaps even the situations that men and women elected and agreed to enter. Foreordination does not preclude the exercise of agency. Foreordination is a conditional preappointment to or bestowal of certain blessings and responsibilities.