Troy and Troy march into Troy: Utah @USC 2017

[U-Ute]

No word on Huntley, so I'm assuming Williams will be starting.

[Diehard Ute]

No word on Huntley, so I'm assuming Williams will be starting.

Even if Tyler is ready they’re not going to tell anyone.

Just like they won’t say a word if Bateman beats out Troy. And with practice entirely closed, we’re not going to hear even rumors as much.


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[sancho]

Even if Tyler is ready they’re not going to tell anyone.

Just like they won’t say a word if Bateman beats out Troy. And with practice entirely closed, we’re not going to hear even rumors as much.



It's exciting! We beat those 5 star pretty boys last year by out-toughing them. Gotta do the same on Sat. Song girl tears are the sweetest!

[sancho]

I feel alright about the game. I know it's a longshot, but we've always matched up decently with USC. They need to run to be successful, and we have a good run defense. Darnold can make amazing throws, but he also makes bad decisions and throws picks. If we get a couple of those and capitalize on them?

This is clearly the best defense we've seen so far. I think they will force Troy to beat them with his arm and head. There will be a lot of pressure until he proves he can make them pay.

[Scorcho]

let's see, USC crushed Stanford and Stanford whipped us, this should be fun.

[concerned]

let's see, USC crushed Stanford and Stanford whipped us, this should be fun.


plus the last two times we stunk it up it in the Coliseum, greatly underperforming on offense when we all had high hopes and expectations and USC was vulnerable. Two years ago we were coming off the 63 points against Oregon and Travis threw 4 picks (IIRC). In 2013, we could barely get the ball across midfield. We are generally pathetic down there.

We have no chance if LA Ute shows up.

[LA Ute]

let's see, USC crushed Stanford and Stanford whipped us, this should be fun.

Hey, after 3 quarters USC was ahead of Stanford only 28-17. Brady Poppinga would call that a win.

[Scorcho]

Wilner sees us in the Sun Bowl, as far as mid-level bowls go, this isn't a bad one IMO

http://www.mercurynews.com/2017/10/11/pac-12-bowl-projections-debut-edition-washington-to-the-playoff-usc-out-of-the-new-years-six/

[concerned]

Wilner sees us in the Sun Bowl, as far as mid-level bowls go, this isn't a bad one IMO

http://www.mercurynews.com/2017/10/11/pac-12-bowl-projections-debut-edition-washington-to-the-playoff-usc-out-of-the-new-years-six/


I saw a projection somewhere that had us matched against UVA in the Sun. That would be fun. Can you imagine the meltdown in Provo if Bronco beat Whit as a wahoo?

[Scorcho]

I saw a projection somewhere that had us matched against UVA in the Sun. That would be fun. Can you imagine the meltdown in Provo if Bronco beat Whit as a wahoo?

haven't they dusted their wooden clogging dance shoes on Bronco? That would be a fun matchup

[LA Ute]

haven't they dusted their wooden clogging dance shoes on Bronco?

:rofl:

Actually, I think the more intelligent BYU fans miss Bronco. I miss him. He was the Energizer Bunny of goofy quotes.

[UTEopia]

:rofl:

Actually, I think the more intelligent BYU fans miss Bronco. I miss him. He was the Energizer Bunny of goofy quotes.

And goofy faces.

[LA Ute]

We have no chance if LA Ute shows up.

I thought about not going, honestly, but I’m going to be selfish and attend the game. It will be my fourth visit to the Colosseum since we joined the conference. So far I am oh for the decade.

[SoCalPat]

I saw a projection somewhere that had us matched against UVA in the Sun. That would be fun. Can you imagine the meltdown in Provo if Bronco beat Whit as a wahoo?

Honest to goodness, I could accept a close loss to UVA on a miracle play or garbage call late just to see the reaction from BYU fans over that. Goodness knows that's the only way a Bronco-coached team has ever beaten us.

[LA Ute]

I would like to see some second down and short situations in this game. Would also be nice to simply get a first down on first down. I know that there is a lot that goes in to making such things happen, but I think we were in too many situations where it was third and short over and over again. Often we made a first down by an inch or two. Of course those first downs count, but that’s just emblematic of how hard it was for us to move the ball. I guess I hope the offense is a little bit more explosive this time. A lot of that depends on playcalling, and a lot depends on our offensive line, which I hope will get its act together better for this Saturday’s game.

[sancho]

I would like to see some second down and short situations in this game. Would also be nice to simply get a first down on first down. I know that there is a lot that goes in to making such things happen, but I think we were in too many situations where it was third and short over and over again. Often we made a first down by an inch or two. Of course those first downs count, but that’s just emblematic of how hard it was for us to move the ball. I guess I hope the offense is a little bit more explosive this time. A lot of that depends on playcalling, and a lot depends on our offensive line, which I hope will get its act together better for this Saturday’s game.

Some UCLA fan tweeted last week "Without Huntley, this is the same Utah team we've seen for the past 6 years. With him, this is the best team in the south."

I think if we win, we win playing Kyle-ball. We need two TD drives (probably coming on big plays) and a few FGs (coming on turnovers). And then we need to milk clock and play defense.

[concerned]

Some UCLA fan tweeted last week "Without Huntley, this is the same Utah team we've seen for the past 6 years. With him, this is the best team in the south."

I think if we win, we win playing Kyle-ball. We need two TD drives (probably coming on big plays) and a few FGs (coming on turnovers). And then we need to milk clock and play defense.

Hard to play Kyle ball unless our running backs really step up. If they replicate John White, Booker, or Joe W, then maybe.

[LA Ute]

Some UCLA fan tweeted last week "Without Huntley, this is the same Utah team we've seen for the past 6 years. With him, this is the best team in the south."

I think if we win, we win playing Kyle-ball. We need two TD drives (probably coming on big plays) and a few FGs (coming on turnovers). And then we need to milk clock and play defense.

I think you are probably right. To accomplish that with Kyle-ball, of course, everything will have to go right for us. No big turnovers by us (such as a pick six), only one big play given up to USC, our D will need to get some turnovers, and so forth. Almost no margin for error. I’m not as confident as you are that we will be able to get some big plays. I hope so, but we’ll see. Within a few minutes of the first quarter we will probably know which Troy Williams is showing up for this game. That will tell the tale, I think.

[sancho]

I’m not as confident as you are

I'm not confident at all. I give us a 10-15% chance. All I'm saying is, if we win, I think it happens in that way.

[LA Ute]

I just heard Scott Mitchell on the Riley show podcast. He says with an injury to the throwing shoulder and related structures, a quarterback really is not himself for the rest of the season. He thinks we will not see Huntley at full strength until next year. That is not a cheery thought but I guess it may be what we’re looking at.

[concerned]

When KW says Huntley "might play" and it is "day to day," can we conclude that he is not playing--that the purpose of that comment is to keep USC guessing? If Huntley really might play, KW would not comment, so as to possibly catch them by surprise???

[SoCalPat]

We see these three stats, we win ...

45-plus carries/designed runs

At least 7 punts for USC

Carrington 100-plus yards receiving

[LA Ute]

If you’re going to the game here in LA, keep in mind that the Dodgers game and the USC-Utah game begin at the same time. The same freeways lead to both places. Give yourself extra time.

[concerned]

somebody fairly close to the team just told me Huntley is playing tonight. FWIW. not sure I believe it.

[Dwight Schr-Ute]

somebody fairly close to the team just told me Huntley is playing tonight. FWIW. not sure I believe it.

That would be an interesting development. Maybe Davir is blowing smokescreen.

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[concerned]

That would be an interesting development. Maybe Davir is blowing smokescreen.

https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20171014/f2c6ad0ca08a823563e8838509b7d7e1.jpg


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Yeah, I not sure I believe it either; who knows. Please disregard anything I have to say.

[LA Ute]

I think the Utes need psychotherapy about the red zone. It’s so strange how we fall apart there.

[sancho]

I think the Utes need psychotherapy about the red zone. It’s so strange how we fall apart there.

At this point, I think it's clear there is some kind of curse involved. I mean, the Cubs and their goat had less evidence than we do.

[LA Ute]

Well maybe with that touchdown we got a little bit of the red zone monkey off our backs.

[LA Ute]

Usually we get this many turnovers we win the game. Hope so.

[Mormon Red Death]

Williams throws a nice long ball but runs like a ninny

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[hostile]

Marquise Blair. Wow.

[sancho]

Great half. USC can score in a hurry, though.

[chrisrenrut]

Moss playing like a man possessed!

[Mormon Red Death]

Besides moss i wish our guys could follow where the hole was or where to run.

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[LA Ute]

Need something to turn things around, get some momentum back. It’s been all USC in the 2nd half.

[Sullyute]

I love watching Blair play


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[Diehard Ute]

I missed everything until the 9 minute mark of the 4th quarter. So I made
it in time to watch USC shove it right down our throat. Awesome. Sigh.


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[Diehard Ute]

Why?

Why go for 2?

Why go for 2 with our QB under center for the first time in how long?


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[LA Ute]

I like the call to go for 2. Our offense could not be counted on to score from the 25 in overtime. In the end Troy’s apparent inability to look downfield when he leaves the pocket cost us big time. I don’t blame the kid. It’s just not in his DNA to to that. Carrington was all alone in the back of the end zone. Troy could have been the hero and made USC look like fools.

[sancho]

I like the call to go for 2. Our offense could not be counted on to score from the 25 in overtime. In the end Troy’s apparent inability to look downfield when he leaves the pocket cost us big time. I don’t blame the kid. It’s just not in his DNA to to that. Carrington was all alone in the back of the end zone. Troy could have been the hero and made USC look like fools.

I don't understand going for 2. The most defining stat of the season for this team is our inability to score in the red zone. Take the overtime. I thought for sure we would send the kicker out after the time out. Dang.

[sancho]

I like the call to go for 2. Our offense could not be counted on to score from the 25 in overtime. In the end Troy’s apparent inability to look downfield when he leaves the pocket cost us big time. I don’t blame the kid. It’s just not in his DNA to to that. Carrington was all alone in the back of the end zone. Troy could have been the hero and made USC look like fools.

I like the chance of OT more than the chance of the 2 point converstion. We have a good kicker, which matters a lot in college OT. Plus, Darnold throws picks.

Fun game. Disappointing finish. Our inability to stop USC on third and long is what cost us the game. They converted over and over again, including on the play of the game from Darnold.

Great to see Moss play so well.

[Dwight Schr-Ute]

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[hostile]

Frustrating to not be able to get the D off the field on multiple occasions in the second half.

I don’t mind the call to go for 2. Poorly executed.

[sancho]

Frustrating to not be able to get the D off the field on multiple occasions in the second half.

I don’t mind the call to go for 2. Poorly executed.

I wouldn't mind it under other circumstances, but we don't have a good track record from the 2 yard line this season. Just take the OT, and see what happens.

[hostile]

I wouldn't mind it under other circumstances, but we don't have a good track record from the 2 yard line this season. Just take the OT, and see what happens.
Yeah. Tough call. Our red zone offense isn’t great. USCs o line was dominating our front 7 over the 4 th quarter. And we have a qb who can’t keep his eyes upfield when he is forced to scramble.

[sancho]

USC had 3 long TD drives in the 2nd half, each involving multiple 3rd and long conversions. One was a 4th and 9. One was a 3rd and 10 with their back against the end zone. Whenever they needed a play, they made it look easy.

I think SC could be a very good team if they had a better coaching staff.

[LA Ute]

I don't understand going for 2. The most defining stat of the season for this team is our inability to score in the red zone. Take the overtime. I thought for sure we would send the kicker out after the time out. Dang.

Here are the things Kyle might have been thinking about: Home team wins in overtime something like 80% of the time. We were unable to stop USC’s offense the entire 2nd half. Our D had been on the field almost the entire half and was obviously gassed. Our team has Red Zone Anxiety and becomes the Keystone Kops when there.

If Troy looks up and flips the ball to Carrington he’s a hero and Kyle’s a gutsy genius.

[chrisrenrut]

USC had 3 long TD drives in the 2nd half, each involving multiple 3rd and long conversions. One was a 4th and 9. One was a 3rd and 10 with their back against the end zone. Whenever they needed a play, they made it look easy.

This is why I don't mind the call to go for 2. Our defense isn't going to stop USC in Overtime. Our offense is going to have to get in the end zone one way or the other. Better to try for it from the 3 for the win that from the 25 for a another tie.

[sancho]

How bout that play call on 4th and 1? First pass to a TE in forever. Loved it.

How about the refs? Borderline incompetence on a handful of spots and other plays (delay of game!), but they sure are excellent at noticing when a lineman goes more than 5 yards downfield.

[chrisrenrut]

This is why I don't mind the call to go for 2. Our defense isn't going to stop USC in Overtime. Our offense is going to have to get in the end zone one way or the other. Better to try for it from the 3 for the win that from the 25 for a another tie.

That being said, I sure didn't expect us to go for 2. I told my dad that we trotted out the offense to make USC burn their last time out. Then I thought for sure we would have some more defined type of scoring play drawn up instead of just having Troy roll-right.

[mUUser]

I like the call to go for 2. Our offense could not be counted on to score from the 25 in overtime. In the end Troy’s apparent inability to look downfield when he leaves the pocket cost us big time. I don’t blame the kid. It’s just not in his DNA to to that. Carrington was all alone in the back of the end zone. Troy could have been the hero and made USC look like fools.

I don't think we had much to think about. Our defense was spent halfway thru the 4q, and were giving up 15 yard chunks up the gut with every handoff. I also don't mind the call, but dang, Carringron was leisurely jogging along the back of the end zone -- why wasn't he jumping up and down waving his arms in the off chance Williams might spot him? Frustrating game from Carrington.

[sancho]

This is why I don't mind the call to go for 2. Our defense isn't going to stop USC in Overtime. Our offense is going to have to get in the end zone one way or the other. Better to try for it from the 3 for the win that from the 25 for a another tie.

Our success in this game came in large part from USC mistakes. I felt happy about hoping for another SC mistake in OT. We got them to 3rd down situations all half long - I'd have loved to give the D another shot.

I feel like our odds on that 2 point conversion, based on what we've seen this season, are about 15-20%. I think our OT odds are closer to 30-40%.

[hostile]

I don't think we had much to think about. Our defense was spent halfway thru the 4q, and were giving up 15 yard chunks up the gut with every handoff. I also don't mind the call, but dang, Carringron was leisurely jogging along the back of the end zone -- why wasn't he jumping up and down waving his arms in the off chance Williams might spot him? Frustrating game from Carrington.
If Troy just looks up and sets his feet he has plenty of time to throw. Plenty of guys blocking in the backfield. He just panicked.

[sancho]

Our defense was spent halfway thru the 4q, and were giving up 15 yard chunks up the gut with every handoff.

This seems to be the main argument for going for two. But remember, they were gassed too. OT is a crazy thing, and you never know what will happen. Utah from the 2 yard line is statistically a very unlikely conversion this year.

[sancho]

That being said, I sure didn't expect us to go for 2. I told my dad that we trotted out the offense to make USC burn their last time out.

That's what I thought too! I thought we were being smart/calculating. Instead, I think we made a decision based on emotion.

[sancho]

Claim: ineligible receiver downfield is the worst rule in football. 100% of the time it is called, it is called for something completely inconsequential to the play.

Also, we win this game if Gay hits that gimmie in the first half.

[chrisrenrut]

This seems to be the main argument for going for two. But remember, they were gassed too. OT is a crazy thing, and you never know what will happen. Utah from the 2 yard line is statistically a very unlikely conversion this year.

USC's offense didn't look very gassed on their last 2 drives. I guess us letting them run willy-nilly might have worn them out some.

[sancho]

USC's offense didn't look very gassed on their last 2 drives. I guess us letting them run willy-nilly might have worn them out some.

No, both defenses were spent, though.

Ugh, that 3rd and 10 scramble from Darnold. That's that game.

[Diehard Ute]

Here are the things Kyle might have been thinking about: Home team wins in overtime something like 80% of the time.

I don’t know where you got that number, the only data I could find was 56% for the Home team.


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[LA Ute]

I don’t know where you got that number, the only data I could find was 56% for the Home team.


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I got it from The Thrill, whom I consider a numbers guru. Maybe he was wrong. The other reasons are good enough. FWIW, Kyle just said in the post-game interview he'd make that call 10 of 10 times. To tell the truth, I really thought we'd kick the FG because that seemed to be the conservative-type call he'd make. Shows you how much I know.

[LA Ute]

Kyle also said that Carrington has some injury issues and it was only his toughness that allowed him to be on the field tonight.

[LA Ute]

Hey, at least the Dodgers won tonight!

Also, I am down with a cold so did not go to the Coliseum tonight. I've proven that my presence there is not a jinx. Take note, concerned.

[concerned]

No, both defenses were spent, though.

Ugh, that 3rd and 10 scramble from Darnold. That's that game.

so many plays where Darnold killed us by a hair's breadth. The one handed catch by his receiver on 4th down. (where his knee was down short of the first down???). the killer--where Tatiloa missed the safety by 1/2 inch, and Darnold completed the first down pass on the sidline at the 12 where the receiver barely kept his toes in bounds. Darnold killed us in the second half. Hats off to him.

[LA Ute]

so many plays where Darnold killed us by a hair's breadth. The one handed catch by his receiver on 4th down. (where his knee was down short of the first down???). the killer--where Tatiloa missed the safety by 1/2 inch, and Darnold completed the first down pass on the sidline at the 12 where the receiver barely kept his toes in bounds. Darnold killed us in the second half. Hats off to him.

He made the plays great players make.

[concerned]

Hey, at least the Dodgers won tonight!

Also, I am down with a cold so did not go to the Coliseum tonight. I've proven that my presence there is not a jinx. Take note, concerned,

If you had showed up, we would have lost 31-10, and I would have won the prediction contest.

[LA Ute]

2274

[Utebiquitous]

Perhaps it's too soon for a Pollyanna post - I share a lot of the frustrations expressed, particularly the if only Troy keeps his eyes up, but...

I saw a lot of improvement tonight. I've been waiting for the run game/O'line to take some significant steps forward. That might have been the biggest improvement. Moss was terrific tonight - what a catch and effort on the last drive (refs totally screwed him on the spot). How about Siaosi Wilson coming up with some nice plays. He emerges with Singleton going down - Simpkins as well. Troy Taylor called a better game. The third and one direct snap to Simpkins on our first drive of the third quarter was too cute but I can't be too critical. I liked the game plan.

It's a tough loss but my expectations for this team just grew significantly even if Huntley can't get back. SC always gives us one of their better games. I agree with the commentators that a rivalry is growing. Imagine that a decade ago.

Just a thrill to be taking shots from one of college football's big boys and giving them right back - we're so close. On to ASU.

[sancho]

Perhaps it's too soon for a Pollyanna post - I share a lot of the frustrations expressed, particularly the if only Troy keeps his eyes up, but...

I saw a lot of improvement tonight. I've been waiting for the run game/O'line to take some significant steps forward. That might have been the biggest improvement. Moss was terrific tonight - what a catch and effort on the last drive (refs totally screwed him on the spot). How about Siaosi Wilson coming up with some nice plays. He emerges with Singleton going down - Simpkins as well. Troy Taylor called a better game. The third and one direct snap to Simpkins on our first drive of the third quarter was too cute but I can't be too critical. I liked the game plan.

It's a tough loss but my expectations for this team just grew significantly even if Huntley can't get back. SC always gives us one of their better games. I agree with the commentators that a rivalry is growing. Imagine that a decade ago.

Just a thrill to be taking shots from one of college football's big boys and giving them right back - we're so close. On to ASU.

I agree with all this. I do think we typically match up better with USC than with some other teams that aren't as good as USC.

[Brian]

Also, nice to see the penalties getting cleaned up. 6 for 40 yards. 1 was a delay that they wanted, and another delay was that bizarro substitution.

I'm happy we have a run game now.

[Applejack]

What a game. Too bad the 2 point conversion failed but the decision to go for it was absolutely the correct decision. I agree with the moss revelation as well as Troy Taylor being much better last night.

[concerned]

This has always been a rebuilding year. only 4 conference homes games, new ol, qb, rb, wr's,oc and db's.

I really have been impressed by our young dbs, esp. Blackmon, Johnson, Blair, and now Guidry, and Afia. Last night was a completely different Moss. Somebody compared him to White. Booker a good comparison too. Biggest problem last night--could never get to Darnold. Really missed Fitts, but Anae, Hart, Fotu, etc. are stepping up too (Heckinger playeed a lot too).

Everybody is stepping up. Now if we just don't fall flat like young teams do. We need Fitts, Huntley and Singleton.

I did not realize that Chase and Anae were both out at the end of the game. Is Hansen's shoulder injury serious?

[sancho]

What a game. Too bad the 2 point conversion failed but the decision to go for it was absolutely the correct decision. I agree with the moss revelation as well as Troy Taylor being much better last night.

It appears I am the only person who doesn't love the idea of putting outcome of the game onto the one type of play we've struggled with most all season.

This is a call that could reasonably be argued either way (unlike the FG decision in Provo this year, which was 100% consensus wrong), so I'm surprised so many are taking the 2-pnt conversion side. Darnold has 10 fumbles and a bunch of picks this season - why do people think we'd have no chance in OT? Yes, they were tearing into our defense, but we had just moved on theirs. As concerned pointed out, all of their scoring drives required great/lucky plays. Maybe their luck runs out? Overtime is basically a coin toss. I just don't think, based on all we've seen this season, that we have 50/50 odds when we line up at the 2.

[sancho]

This has always been a rebuilding year. only 4 conference homes games, new ol, qb, rb, wr's,oc and db's.

I really have been impressed by our young dbs, esp. Blackmon, Johnson, Blair, and now Guidry, and Afia. Last night was a completely different Moss. Somebody compared him to White. Booker a good comparison too. Biggest problem last night--could never get to Darnold. Really missed Fitts, but Anae, Hart, Fotu, etc. are stepping up too (Heckinger playeed a lot too).

Everybody is stepping up. Now if we just don't fall flat like young teams do. We need Fitts, Huntley and Singleton.

I did not realize that Chase and Anae were both out at the end of the game. Is Hansen's shoulder injury serious?

I'm not sure what the right comparison is for Moss. Not quick like White, and not bruising like Booker. But he played a great game. Harding always seems to get the run blocking together sooner or later.

Sack Lake City is still AWOL this season.

[Diehard Ute]

Things that haven’t been mentioned.

We were, once again, without Fitts and Anae at the end of the game.

We were also without Chase.

That’s 3 big guys to be missing. I’m sure that played into Kyle’s thought process.

Kyle mentioned in his post game comments he knew our defense was short on players and was gassed due to the injuries.


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[Mormon Red Death]

I like the call to go for 2 is the same reason i liked both 4th and short. You are challenging your team to win the game by getting 3 yards.

Btw had fakavailatoga had scored they would have kicked

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[snafu]

What a game! Hard to lose that one but I like the fight in these guys.

As for the 2-point conversion, I'm fine with it but is there some reason teams don't put out the kicking team and pretend to be kicking the extra point? Why not add the element of surprise in that situation? Maybe there is some unwritten rule in college football preventing a play like that. Just curious.

[Brian]

Btw had fakavailatoga had scored they would have kicked

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good point. I wonder if he had just tried to bust through that defender, instead of waiting for a block, he could have made it in.
woulda-coulda-shoulda. Still a great game (I thought the two score vegas line was about right), and very happy with the effort.

[SoCalPat]

Responses to this thread and other thoughts ...

There ain't a stat alive out there that shows home teams win 80 percent in OT. Not in college football, where winning the coin flip (a 50-50 prop) plays such a huge outcome in what you can and cannot do on offense. FWIW, I hate college OT. The NFL version is superior in nearly every way imaginable.

I don't think there can be any judgment attached to Kyle's decision to go for 2. Plenty of arguments exist for both sides. I was convinced when USC called timeout, that Kyle got what he wanted USC to do -- burn its last timeout (Belichick is a master at getting teams to do this -- he's playing chess when everyone else is playing checkers). With 42 seconds left, you're borderline with most QBs on getting into FG range. You also have to take into account USC's kicking game, not just from distance, but what it can do in OT. The overwhelming thought in Kyle's mind was this: USC has a future No. 1 pick in the draft who has largely shredded us, and we cannot compete with that.

Judgment, of course, can be passed on the actual play call, but let's be honest -- there's not a whole lot we do in the pass game from the 2. That's probably the best argument that exists for kicking the PAT.

Darnold is a Pro. Never got flustered, made all the throws, is more elusive than even his own coaches probably give him credit for. He shredded us in the second half. Good riddance.

My guess is USC went to a lot more zone in the second half. You play us man, you're playing into what Troy does best, which is sit back in the pocket and throw deep.

I was screaming at the TV and Kyle to call a timeout on the Moss catch-and-run that resulted in a horrible spot. We had clear video evidence that Moss got the first down. The game is tied and we have 10:36 left in the game, ball on our own 30. Someone has to let Kyle know that we've got the first down, so we gotta let the booth have time to realize the error that was made by the refs on the field. That there was a measurement and still no one called it to our attention is beyond baffling. Instead of calling timeout (because we really need to think this one through), we rush to call a play, send our horrible running QB into the line and get the first down only because of another horrible spot by the refs. A complete and total breakdown by the coaching staff on that sequence.

We needed to establish the run, get USC's offense off the field and find Carrington early and often. We did very well in the run game (still needed more carries than we got from Moss, who played easily his best game ever at Utah), we won the turnover battle, and although we failed in getting Carrington involved, we were actually a far more efficient team in the passing game than USC (9.5 YPA to 7.2).

In the end, I don't know what more we could've done to win this game, but I can't for the life of me explain how we lost it, save for the fact that USC had Sam Darnold. We played great and lost. That's unfortunate, but that happens in football.

[justaute]

Another angle of the 2-pt conversion attempt. Sigh...

https://twitter.com/JFurKSL/status/919408305042178049

[concerned]

anybody watch the UM-UI overtime yesterday? UM scored on the first play, a broken-play 25 yard run. UI then got to a first down on the two and couldn't score a TD in four plays. You cant blame KW for wanting to avoid it, given the play of our D and Darnold in the second half.

[LA Ute]

Please don’t misunderstand me, I’m not claiming a moral victory in any way. It did occur to me just now that when I first started paying attention to Utah football, a game like this would have been simply for the money. We would have gone to the Coliseum like lambs to the slaughter and would never have expected even to be competitive in the game.

[Dwight Schr-Ute]

To pile on SoCals gripe about the coaching staff not challenging bad calls, this was another important miss that’s still eating at me. This was on SC’s 4th and 9 play in the middle of their 98 yard scoring drive to pull within 7. Dude’s knee was clearly down short of the first down marker but he scrambled for a few more yards and they give him the easy first down. That drive really changed the mood.

https://twitter.com/jdutezone/status/919415297265713154


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[Dwight Schr-Ute]

I'm not sure what the right comparison is for Moss. Not quick like White, and not bruising like Booker. But he played a great game. Harding always seems to get the run blocking together sooner or later.

Sack Lake City is still AWOL this season.

No one tell Cam Smith.


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[NorthwestUteFan]

To pile on SoCals gripe about the coaching staff not challenging bad calls, this was another important miss that’s still eating at me. This was on SC’s 4th and 9 play in the middle of their 98 yard scoring drive to pull within 7. Dude’s knee was clearly down short of the first down marker but he scrambled for a few more yards and they give him the easy first down. That drive really changed the mood.

https://twitter.com/jdutezone/status/919415297265713154


Sent from my iPhone using TapatalkThat was the play of the game. That was a bigger miss than the 2pt conversion.

[sancho]

That was the play of the game. That was a bigger miss than the 2pt conversion.

A huge missed call that should have been reviewed. Whoever was in the review booth was asleep at the wheel for a large part of the game. Someone actually got paid to blow those calls.

[sancho]

anybody watch the UM-UI overtime yesterday? UM scored on the first play, a broken-play 25 yard run. UI then got to a first down on the two and couldn't score a TD in four plays. You cant blame KW for wanting to avoid it, given the play of our D and Darnold in the second half.

No, you can't blame Whitt. The call was defensible. It just wasn't the call I wanted.

Of course, for every Mich/IU game, there is another game where the lesser team manages to win in OT.

[sancho]

Judgment, of course, can be passed on the actual play call, but let's be honest -- there's not a whole lot we do in the pass game from the 2. That's probably the best argument that exists for kicking the PAT.


This was my reasoning. When we came out after the time out still intending to go for it, I figured we must have something lined up we felt strongly about. Of course, if we had such a play, we'd have used it last week against Stanford on third and goal.



In the end, I don't know what more we could've done to win this game, but I can't for the life of me explain how we lost it, save for the fact that USC had Sam Darnold. We played great and lost. That's unfortunate, but that happens in football.

To be fair, USC moved the ball easily for most of the game and finished with over 500 yards. If not for their turnovers in the first half, the game would have been lopsided.

[DrumNFeather]

I thought Kyle might call his second time out after USC had called its time out and we lined up...something to throw them off...wacky formation, hard count, something. Other than that, zero objection to the call.

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[sancho]

I swear I'm not trying to beat a dead horse here, but my brother asked me if I could think of any high profile examples of a team winning by going for two instead of taking overtime. Boise State over Oklahoma in the GOAT bowl is the one I can think of. I can think of many examples of the opposite - Nebraska for the title, Utah this weekend, BYU last year, GT losing to Tennessee this year. Feels like we see coaches try and fail at this a few times every year.

I'm not sure there would be enough examples to collect a statistically significant sample, but I wonder if going for 2 in this situation has an even lower conversion percentage than in other situations.

[Mormon Red Death]

Arkansas beat ole miss 2 years ago like that.

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[LA Ute]

The art of the 2 point conversion: When and why to go for it

The art of the 2 point conversion: When and why to go for it (http://www.ncaa.com/news/football/article/2017-10-11/art-2-point-conversion-when-and-why-go-it)

For whatever it is worth.

[U-Ute]

Trigger warning:

http://www.utahby5.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=2275&stc=1

[U-Ute]

A friend of mine that is a Ute pointed out something interesting today: Is there something going on with TW and Carrington? You'd think he'd be looking for Carrington more. Then there was the pass in the first half in which Carrington looked like he didn't even expect it.

I heard Whittingham's comments that DC is fighting through something, but still, it seems like TW is avoiding DC.

[chrisrenrut]

Trigger warning:

http://www.utahby5.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=2275&stc=1

Threethings:

1- Troy is already going down at this point. Still, if his eyes were up he might have seen Carrington breaking open.

2- Why aren't Carrington's hands up in the air signaling he is open?

3- If he did pass, at least we wouldn't have any ineligible lineman downfield.

[concerned]

Threethings:

1- Troy is already going down at this point. Still, if his eyes were up he might have seen Carrington breaking open.

2- Why aren't Carrington's hands up in the air signaling he is open?

3- If he did pass, at least we wouldn't have any ineligible lineman downfield.

Carrington was wide open earlier in the sequence well before TW engaged the USC defenders. FWIW.

[LA Ute]

Carrington was wide open earlier in the sequence well before TW engaged the USC defenders. FWIW.

I listened to the podcast this morning of KW's press conference. Also FWIW, he thought the pass to Carrington should have been made. I don't think we should be too hard on Troy, but we need to call it what it was: a blown opportunity at the critical moment of the game. He flips that ball to Carrington and we are all celebrating a great historic win.

[concerned]

I listened to the podcast this morning of KW's press conference. Also FWIW, he thought the pass to Carrington should have been made. I don't think we should be too hard on Troy, but we need to call it what it was: a blown opportunity at the critical moment of the game. He flips that ball to Carrington and we are all celebrating a great historic win.


Somebody pointed out this morning that SC had :42, 3 timeouts, and a great field goal kicker. so who knows for sure what would have happened. And the failure of the UA qb to see open receivers played a big part in our win down there.

[DrumNFeather]

Somebody pointed out this morning that SC had :42, 3 timeouts, and a great field goal kicker. so who knows for sure what would have happened. And the failure of the UA qb to see open receivers played a big part in our win down there.

SC only had one time out, and Kyle got them to burn it when we lined up to go for two. Nevertheless, Darnold probably could've gotten them down the field in 42 seconds. He was shredding our D.

[concerned]

SC only had one time out, and Kyle got them to burn it when we lined up to go for two. Nevertheless, Darnold probably could've gotten them down the field in 42 seconds. He was shredding our D.

You are right about that. i dont know why I heard otherwise. Maybe I was hallucinating. Brain cramp.

[Solon]

Somebody pointed out this morning that SC had :42, 3 timeouts, and a great field goal kicker. so who knows for sure what would have happened. And the failure of the UA qb to see open receivers played a big part in our win down there.

Not sure about USC's FG kicker either. After all, SC decided to go for it on 4th and 9 at the Utah 27 rather than kick a FG. It was 3rd quarter and Utah led 21-14.
http://www.espn.com/college-football/playbyplay?gameId=400935297

[Diehard Ute]

If you watch the video of the 2 point try Troy’s weakness is exposed.

He leaves the pocket early, and when he leaves he abandons the pass play and goes into run mode. If he’d just drifted outside while still running the play he had space and time. But instead he went out and forward, with his head down.


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[LA Ute]

If you watch the video of the 2 point try Troy’s weakness is exposed.

He leaves the pocket early, and when he leaves he abandons the pass play and goes into run mode. If he’d just drifted outside while still running the play he had space and time. But instead he went out and forward, with his head down.


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Also, as Riley pointed put today, Troy rolled right (as he always seems to do) where all the traffic was, instead of stepping left, where he would have had a couple of seconds to set his feet. I'm not sure this is a fair criticism, because I think the play called for Troy to hit the TE on the right side of the field, but USC saw that coming and covered the TE. But still, looking at this clip, it sure does look like he panicked and headed right:

https://twitter.com/JFurKSL/status/919408305042178049

[concerned]

Not sure about USC's FG kicker either. After all, SC decided to go for it on 4th and 9 at the Utah 27 rather than kick a FG. It was 3rd quarter and Utah led 21-14.
http://www.espn.com/college-football/playbyplay?gameId=400935297

He beat Texas with a long field goal.

[tooblue]

Also, as Riley pointed put today, Troy rolled right (as he always seems to do) where all the traffic was, instead of stepping left, where he would have had a couple of seconds to set his feet. I'm not sure this is a fair criticism, because I think the play called for Troy to hit the TE on the right side of the field, but USC saw that coming and covered the TE. But still, looking at this clip, it sure does look like he panicked and headed right:

https://twitter.com/JFurKSL/status/919408305042178049

The play is a designed roll out to the right, then throw back to a receiver(s) going the opposite direction. USC read it and had it covered. Williams was never meant to stay in a straight drop back pocket, the pocket is designed to move to the right with him.

Going for the two point conversion was the right call (desperate times call for desperate measures). The play call was not a good one.

[concerned]

The play is a designed roll out to the right, then throw back to a receiver(s) going the opposite direction. USC read and had it covered. Williams was never meant to stay in a pocket, the pocket is designed to move to the right with him.

Yep. The problem was that USC recognized it as a pass to the tight end, but their db's did not communicate. Two db's both covered the tight end; one was supposed to switch over to Carrington. When tW saw the TE covered, he ducked and ran.

[LA Ute]

The play is a designed roll out to the right, then throw back to a receiver(s) going the opposite direction. USC read it and had it covered. Williams was never meant to stay in a straight drop back pocket, the pocket is designed to move to the right with him.

As I said, I wonder if Riley's criticism is fair. But if you look at the video it is not unreasonable to believe Troy could have stepped left. There wasn't a full rollout to the right. When he tucks and runs, he always goes right, unfortunately, and doesn't look for a receiver. Here, he ran right into traffic. As a spoiled fan, I think Huntley, with his better "escapability" and instincts, might well have made something happen in a play like this. Then again, with Huntley I think a different play might have been called.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Np8jwYxNIM4

[justaute]

Good comment here. I think many Utes fans with red goggles overlooked this.




To be fair, USC moved the ball easily for most of the game and finished with over 500 yards. If not for their turnovers in the first half, the game would have been lopsided.

[Utebiquitous]

There are always multiple ways to look at things. Sure, USC moved the ball on us the whole game but where have you been for all of the Kyle's career at Utah? Teams get yards on Utah but the Utes tend to keep the score down. Besides, Utah had it's own stumbles in the first half. A missed field goal - an easy field goal at that, and an interception in the redzone (great play by Cameron Smith). That's ten points. Could we just call the game what it was - close, hard fought, another awesome game in the USC-Utah series? I'm going to choose that narrative if you don't mind. In this case, it's a lot closer than the fiction you and Sancho want to embrace.

[hostile]

There are always multiple ways to look at things. Sure, USC moved the ball on us the whole game but where have you been for all of the Kyle's career at Utah? Teams get yards on Utah but the Utes tend to keep the score down. Besides, Utah had it's own stumbles in the first half. A missed field goal - an easy field goal at that, and an interception in the redzone (great play by Cameron Smith). That's ten points. Could we just call the game what it was - close, hard fought, another awesome game in the USC-Utah series? I'm going to choose that narrative if you don't mind. In this case, it's a lot closer than the fiction you and Sancho want to embrace.
We did score on the fumble by Darnold in the series following the INT so we effectively did get seven points on that drive. The missed FG hurt.

[LA Ute]

There are always multiple ways to look at things. Sure, USC moved the ball on us the whole game but where have you been for all of the Kyle's career at Utah? Teams get yards on Utah but the Utes tend to keep the score down. Besides, Utah had it's own stumbles in the first half. A missed field goal - an easy field goal at that, and an interception in the redzone (great play by Cameron Smith). That's ten points. Could we just call the game what it was - close, hard fought, another awesome game in the USC-Utah series? I'm going to choose that narrative if you don't mind. In this case, it's a lot closer than the fiction you and Sancho want to embrace.

USC’s turnovers were not gifts. One of them was forced and produced an immediate TD. Also, it seems to me that if one team has fewer TOs than the other, that means the team with fewer TOs has outplayed the other team in that regard.

[sancho]

it's a lot closer than the fiction you and Sancho want to embrace.

Hey, don't put words in my mouth. No one claimed this was not a close, hard fought, awesome game. I believe Utah played a great game, and USC moved the ball easily. Those two things are not mutually exclusive.

By the way, since you mentioned it, was the Cam Smith interception really a great play? Troy threw it right at him. He was caught between a blitz and pass coverage (no man's land), and Troy tried to throw it through him. Cam jumped, but he didn't have to. It hit him in the numbers. Cam is clearly a great player, but just about any LB makes that pick.

[Utebiquitous]

Sancho,
Don't mean to offend - I did come off a little to flippant to you and justaute. My apologies.

As to Cam Smith - I just think an interception that close to the line of scrimmage is pretty remarkable because the ball's traveling at a pretty good speed. Definitely a poor play by Williams who needed to find another way to get the ball to Nacua who I think was open on the play.