John Zorn at 60, or, Burn in Hell Wynton Marsalis and Ken Burns

[mpfunk]

Easily the most underrated and unappreciated musician ever.

http://www.walkerart.org/magazine/2013/john-zorn-birthday-60
http://www.walkerart.org/magazine/2013/john-zorn-60-birthday

[Snowman]

I have around, maybe 10 of his CDs or CDs that he plays on. I know his discography is endless so he's hard to get a real grasp on but I tend to think he's actually OVERrated by people who get really excited for the Mike Patton collaborations but really don't dig too deeply into free jazz. I also feel like Zorn tends to have too much ego and is overbearing against the other musicians he's collaborating with.

Also, Wynton does his thing; Zorn does his. There's room enough in this world for both.

[mpfunk]

I have around, maybe 10 of his CDs or CDs that he plays on. I know his discography is endless so he's hard to get a real grasp on but I tend to think he's actually OVERrated by people who get really excited for the Mike Patton collaborations but really don't dig too deeply into free jazz. I also feel like Zorn tends to have too much ego and is overbearing against the other musicians he's collaborating with.

Also, Wynton does his thing; Zorn does his. There's room enough in this world for both.

Oh I agree, there is room enough in the world for both Zorn and Wynton to do their thing. The problem is that Wynton has one of the strongest voices in Jazz and his insistence to turn Jazz into a dead genre where anything outside the Louis Armstrong tradition isn't valid has done serious damage to the music. This is the guy that discredited about 75% of the work of John Coltrane and unfortunately is the go to guy for Jazz criticism. Crouch and Wynton really hurt jazz with the Ken Burn's documentary. It is still amazing that Zorn didn't even get a mention in that documentary.

You are right it is tough to really get a grasp on his entire discography. I tend to dig into the free jazz, classical, and composer side of Zorn and I think that stuff is downright fantastic. I'll forgive any overbearing and ego for the quality of the music. Masada and Bar Kokhba are really my favorites of his work with the standouts being: Masada - Live at Tonic; Bar Kokhba - Lucifer; and, Bar Kokhba - 50th birthday celebration. I've also really enjoyed a lot of the albums in his 2nd book of Masada.

[Snowman]

I also hold Live at Tonic in high regard.


If you haven't heard it I recommend

http://www.allmusic.com/album/peace-on-earth-the-music-of-john-coltrane-mw0000644639

Prima Materia
Peace on Earth: The Music of John Coltrane.

For me, it's easily my favorite record I've listened to that Zorn plays on. Actually, it's among my favorite records period. No complaints about Zorn's contributions on this one.


I actually agree with you about Ken Burns and Wynton. If you don't appreciate free jazz that shows a lack of understanding of where jazz was headed from the get go. Free jazz, and especially late period Coltrane, is the pinnacle of all jazz, of all 20th C music even. But I don't expect people to understand nor do I care if they don't. Ken Burns hasn't hampered free jazz or the growth of the experimental avant garde. In fact, it would be worse if he had polluted it with his documentary. Leave those records where they belong: with the people who wouldn't be denied, the people who set out from the beginning to find them. That music belongs to you and me. For now, acceptance will come in time. Burns will be laughed at like the past critics of Beethoven's late string quartets.

[mpfunk]

I also hold Live at Tonic in high regard.


If you haven't heard it I recommend

http://www.allmusic.com/album/peace-on-earth-the-music-of-john-coltrane-mw0000644639

Prima Materia
Peace on Earth: The Music of John Coltrane.

For me, it's easily my favorite record I've listened to that Zorn plays on. Actually, it's among my favorite records period. No complaints about Zorn's contributions on this one.


I actually agree with you about Ken Burns and Wynton. If you don't appreciate free jazz that shows a lack of understanding of where jazz was headed from the get go. Free jazz, and especially late period Coltrane, is the pinnacle of all jazz, of all 20th C music even. But I don't expect people to understand nor do I care if they don't. Ken Burns hasn't hampered free jazz or the growth of the experimental avant garde. In fact, it would be worse if he had polluted it with his documentary. Leave those records where they belong: with the people who wouldn't be denied, the people who set out from the beginning to find them. That music belongs to you and me. For now, acceptance will come in time. Burns will be laughed at like the past critics of Beethoven's late string quartets.

I pretty much agree with everything that you said, even though it still kind of pisses me off about the Ken Burn's documentary.

I'll pick-up Prima Materia and give it a listen.

Good to see another free jazz fan on the board.