I Wish I Knew How to Quit You - The BYU Sports Thread

[Dwight Schr-Ute]

Not sure why I hate myself so much today, but this two minute listen gave me a smile. Missed it by that much.


https://youtu.be/C1tNNBGvJRQ?t=3m42s

[Utah]

Taysom's shot at a Heisman reminds me of a joke I heard a comic tell:

"Studies show that a number of women may be interested in me. That number is zero."

It's not so much the facts that are important, it's how you report the facts that counts.

[SoCalPat]

"After suffering a season-ending leg injury last season, Taysom Hill returns to BYU Football for his senior season and a final shot at the Heisman trophy."

A final shot? Has he had a shot before?

He's easily a finalist if he doesn't get injured last year. Mind you, he had zero shot of winning it. But he would've had the numbers and already had the highlight-reel performance.

[DrumNFeather]

"After suffering a season-ending leg injury last season, Taysom Hill returns to BYU Football for his senior season and a final shot at the Heisman trophy."

A final shot? Has he had a shot before?

Tom Brady and I have 4 Superbowl rings between us.

[concerned]

Since I plan to live forever, I have the same shot at the Heisman as an infinite number of monkeys at at infinite number of word processors have of writing Hamlet.

[Utah]

He's easily a finalist if he doesn't get injured last year. Mind you, he had zero shot of winning it. But he would've had the numbers and already had the highlight-reel performance.

Snicker.

[SoCalPat]

Snicker.

Whatever. Every Heisman pundit listed Hill before his injury, and everyone putting together such a preseason list will have him on it this year.

[wally]

Whatever. Every Heisman pundit listed Hill before his injury, and everyone putting together such a preseason list will have him on it this year.

I agree. Also, I would trade both Wilson and Thompson straight up for Hill. Sorry if that bothers someone here.

[sancho]

I agree. Also, I would trade both Wilson and Thompson straight up for Hill. Sorry if that bothers someone here.

I would make that trade too. But since we don't have him, I have no problem with mocking him. Due to recent experience, however, I will stop short of hoping he tears his ACL.

[wally]

I would make that trade too

You one smart guy!

[sancho]

I agree. Also, I would trade both Wilson and Thompson straight up for Hill. Sorry if that bothers someone here.

This made me curious, but not curious enough to do the research. How many seasons over the past 20 years would Utah fans trade starting QBs with BYU? I'm guessing it's not an uncommon situation for us to be in.

[LA Ute]

This made me curious, but not curious enough to do the research. How many seasons over the past 20 years would Utah fans trade starting QBs with BYU? I'm guessing it's not an uncommon situation for us to be in.

An excellent point. College football programs each have a culture. BYU's is a QB/offense culture; ours is a defense culture.


Whatever. Every Heisman pundit listed Hill before his injury, and everyone putting together such a preseason list will have him on it this year.

You are of course right. I just like to poke fun at the hype that comes out of BYU Athletics. To me it seems like a special kind of hype, a little more breathless and starry-eyed than any other I know of. It's hard to describe.

[sancho]

You are of course right. I just like to poke fun at the hype that comes out of BYU Athletics. To me it seems like a special kind of hype, a little more breathless and starry-eyed than any other I know of. It's hard to describe.

There is a certain percentage of BYU students (not sure how large or small) who insist on making every piece of college life, including the athletics, a religious experience.

[Dwight Schr-Ute]

You are of course right. I just like to poke fun at the hype that comes out of BYU Athletics. To me it seems like a special kind of hype, a little more breathless and starry-eyed than any other I know of. It's hard to describe.

This is the very reason that I posted the second clip with Blaine Fowler. Despite the cycle they seem to go through every year, they just can't help themselves from over reaching. In that clip not only are they posturing about having an undefeated '14 season, but they even double down and carry their undefeatedness through September '15 and a top 4 ranking! What could possibly go wrong?!

[chrisrenrut]

Whatever. Every Heisman pundit listed Hill before his injury, and everyone putting together such a preseason list will have him on it this year.

The problem is, the style of play Taysom needs to put up this numbers is also likely to keep him from staying healthy for a full season. If they change the offense to limit his exposure, he doesn't have the skillset to put up a Heisman worthy performance.

[sancho]

The problem is, the style of play Taysom needs to put up this numbers is also likely to keep him from staying healthy for a full season. If they change the offense to limit his exposure, he doesn't have the skillset to put up a Heisman worthy performance.

I don't know. Plenty of running QBs have managed to stay healthy over the course of a season. It just takes a little luck.

[LA Ute]

There is a certain percentage of BYU students (not sure how large or small) who insist on making every piece of college life, including the athletics, a religious experience.

That's probably it. A little extra spiritual pixie dust sprinkled on every hope and aspiration.


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[SoCalPat]

An excellent point. College football programs each have a culture. BYU's is a QB/offense culture; ours is a defense culture.



You are of course right. I just like to poke fun at the hype that comes out of BYU Athletics. To me it seems like a special kind of hype, a little more breathless and starry-eyed than any other I know of. It's hard to describe.

Getting Taysom to NYC would be a reasonable and reachable goal. But BYU and its fans wouldn't be what they are if you injected them with a vial full of reasonable.

[SoCalPat]

This made me curious, but not curious enough to do the research. How many seasons over the past 20 years would Utah fans trade starting QBs with BYU? I'm guessing it's not an uncommon situation for us to be in.

Off the top of my head ...

1995: Keep Fouts (Sarkisian)
1996: Trade Fouts (Sarkisian)
1997-2000: This is a really choppy era. Outside of Arceneaux, none of our QBs are worth keeping. Trouble is, none of BYU's are worth trading for.
2001: Trade Rice (Doman)
2002: Keep Elliott (BYU's worst QB year ever)
2003: Keep Alex (see above)
2004: Keep Alex
2005: Keep Brian (John Beck)
2006: Trade Ratliff (John Beck)
2007: Keep (healthy) Brian (Max Hall)
2008: Keep Brian (Hall)
2009: Keep Cain/Wynn (Hall)
2010: Keep Wynn (Nelson/Heaps)
2011: Keep Wynn (Heaps)
2012: Jon Hays vs. Riley Nelson. Really?
2013: Keep Wilson (Hill)
2014-present: Trade Wilson (Hill)

[Dwight Schr-Ute]

On pure skill set and ignoring personality (is that against the rules?), I don't agree with 2009.

[Utah]

I'm not so sure I'd trade Wilson for Hill.

Look at Wilson's #'s vs mid majors. Look at Hill's numbers vs P5 teams.

I think the two QB's are a lot closer than we realize, but the competition skews the picture.

I'll see if I can dig up the stats in my spreadsheets and post them.

[wally]

I'm not so sure I'd trade Wilson for Hill.

Yes you are. Wilson is a pretty decent-ish BQ, and I like him, but if all their numbers are relatively equal, who do you think is the better leader? I am not going to chose the guy that got detained at a Tim McGraw concert.

Besides, Hill is a legit Heisman candidate. Even has videos on youtube.

[USS Utah]

Plus, without any receivers, it's not like Utah needs a QB who can throw.

[sancho]

Plus, without any receivers, it's not like Utah needs a QB who can throw.

I hate our wr situation. Isn't there a jc transfer joining us for fall?

[Diehard Ute]

I hate our wr situation. Isn't there a jc transfer joining us for fall?

We have several new receivers for fall


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[U-Ute]

I don't know. Plenty of running QBs have managed to stay healthy over the course of a season. It just takes a little luck.

Maybe he's not living right.

[Utah]

So, I dug through my spreadsheets and here is how Wilson and Hill stack up:

I skipped 2012, because TW only played vs P5 and TH only played against mid majors (MM).

TW vs P5 2013: 58%, 267 yards, 2 TD, 3 INT, 6 yards/rush attempt, 1 TD/game
TH vs P5 2013: 46%, 210 yards, .71 TD, .85 INT, 5.5 yards/rush attempt, .85 TD/game

in 2013, vs P5 competition, Wilson was the better QB when Wilson was healthy.

TW vs MM 2013: 67%, 280 yards/gm, 2 TD, 0 INT, 5 yards/rush attempt, 1 TD/game
TH vs MM 2013: 66%, 235 yards/gm, 2 TD, 1 INT, 5 yards/rush attempt, 0.8 TD/game

Again, TW was the better QB vs MM comp.

TW vs P5 2014: 60%, 173 yards, 1 TD, 0.5 INT, 1 yard/rush attempt, 0 TD/game
TH vs P5 2014: 51%, 215 yards, 1 TD, 1 INT, 5 yards/rush attempt, 1 TD/game

Would you definitely take Hill over Wilson? I'm not so sure. Kind of a toss up.

TW vs MM 2014: 64%, 201 yards, 2 TD, 0 INT, 5 yards/rush attempt, 1 TD/game
TH vs MM 2014: 70%, 202 yards, 1.5 TD, 0.667 INT, 6 yards/rush attempt, 1 TD/game

Again, where is Hill "clearly" the better QB? Kind of a toss up.

Career averages:
TW vs P5: 60%, 171 yards, 1 TD, 1 INT, 1.42 yards/rush attempt, 0.315 TD/game
TH vs P5: 49%, 204 yards, 0.77 TD, 0.77 INT, 5 yards/rush attempt, 1 TD/game

TW vs MM: 65%, 240 yards, 2 TD, 0 INT, 5.5 yards/rush attempt, 1 TD/game
TH vs MM: 66%, 213 yards, 2 TD, 1 INT, 5.5 yards/rush attempt, .77 TD/game

TW vs P5: 9-10
TH vs P5: 4-5

TW vs MM: 6-0
TH vs MM: 9-0

Utah's record years TW started: 5-7, 5-7, 9-4 (final ranking of 21)
BYU's record years TH started: 8-5, 8-5, 8-5

Now, who knows what BYU could have done last year if Hill had stayed healthy. That being said, who knows how Utah could have been in 2013 if Wilson had stayed healthy. We were 4-2 and had just beat #5 Stanford. So, the point is injuries happen.

Taysom Hill is a product of some highlight reels and subpar competition. Statistically, he is not heads and shoulders above Wilson. Like I said, I'm not sure I trade Hill for Wilson. They both have their ups and downs. Wilson is a better passer. Hill is a better runner. Don't get suckered into some highlights and stats padded by mid-majors. Neither one is a very good QB.

[Utah]

tl/dr

They have eerily, identical stats. Neither one is a great QB, and neither one is a heisman QB. Wilson has led a top 25 team, Hill has not. That is about the only number that is different between the two.

[Utah]

Yes you are. Wilson is a pretty decent-ish BQ, and I like him, but if all their numbers are relatively equal, who do you think is the better leader? I am not going to chose the guy that got detained at a Tim McGraw concert.

Besides, Hill is a legit Heisman candidate. Even has videos on youtube.

One, if their numbers are equal, either Hill is not a heisman contender or Wilson is. You can't have it both ways.

Two, the Tim McGraw concert? Come one, we are better than that. KVN received a DUI. That didn't prove anything on the field. The McGraw concert is completely 100% irrelevant.

Three, Wilson has beaten top 10 teams. Hill has beat a Texas team that was ranked 15, but ended the year unranked. Stanford ended the year #5.

Again, I'm not sure I'm trading Hill for Wilson. Other than a couple of highlights (BTW, I can show just as many hurdling highlight of Wilson), what is the difference between two average QB's?

There is a reason why Stanford wanted to move Hill to safety, and why Hill then transferred to BYU. He is an average QB with no chance at the NFL as a QB.

Right now, today, Wilson is still the better NFL prospect. Wilson could come out, have a huge year and get drafted. Hill probably won't, because he can't pass worth a crap. Hill is a really, really poor man's Tebow. Wilson could come out and have a year like Osweiler's SR year. Probably won't happen, but it has a better chance of happening than Hill suddenly becoming an NFL QB.

[LA Ute]

But like wally said, Taysom Hill has a lot of Youtubes. Plus a really cool first name.

[Diehard Ute]

But like wally said, Taysom Hill has a lot of Youtubes. Plus a really cool first name.

If you rate it on the Utah county south naming system


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[Rocker Ute]

I'm not as upset about the possession of alcohol by a minor as I am that he was at a Tim McGraw concert.

Now, typing this on my phone I'm upset that the predictive typing function had 'McGraw' properly capitalized and in there.

[SoCalPat]

tl/dr

They have eerily, identical stats. Neither one is a great QB, and neither one is a heisman QB. Wilson has led a top 25 team, Hill has not. That is about the only number that is different between the two.

How convenient of you to give a half-painted canvas of Hill's rushing statistics. He ran for 1,344 yards in 2013, a figure that would rank fourth all-time at Utah for single-season rushing. He might very well rank higher if you use the NFL model for rushing yards, which takes sacks surrendered and applies it to passing yards, not rushing yards. His 259 rushing yards against Texas that year would be a Utah single-game school record. If Hill has another 2013-like rushing season this year, he would threaten the career rushing mark at Utah (3,219, Eddie Johnson).

No one, and I mean no one, with any credibility in the national CFB sporting press would dare attempt to make the argument you're trying to make. They would get laughed out of the room. Hill's running ability is miles ahead of whatever Wilson's best quality is, and as you've clearly shown, there's not a lot of separation between both as passers. Eerily, identical stats? That's fanboy garbage right there. Find me the stat in which Wilson ranks as an all-timer like Hill has with rushing.

[sancho]

Football stats are mostly meaningless. I know by the eye test that Hill is the better QB. I'm okay with that. I like our QB a lot, and I think we are better than BYU in pretty much every other position except maybe TE and WR.

[utefan]

How convenient of you to give a half-painted canvas of Hill's rushing statistics. He ran for 1,344 yards in 2013, a figure that would rank fourth all-time at Utah for single-season rushing. He might very well rank higher if you use the NFL model for rushing yards, which takes sacks surrendered and applies it to passing yards, not rushing yards. His 259 rushing yards against Texas that year would be a Utah single-game school record. If Hill has another 2013-like rushing season this year, he would threaten the career rushing mark at Utah (3,219, Eddie Johnson).

No one, and I mean no one, with any credibility in the national CFB sporting press would dare attempt to make the argument you're trying to make. They would get laughed out of the room. Hill's running ability is miles ahead of whatever Wilson's best quality is, and as you've clearly shown, there's not a lot of separation between both as passers. Eerily, identical stats? That's fanboy garbage right there. Find me the stat in which Wilson ranks as an all-timer like Hill has with rushing.
I think part of his point was that Hill's stats are inflated by the number of mid majors he plays against. Hard to compare his overall stats with Wilson's when Wilson is playing one of the toughest schedules in the nation.

He could have also mentioned that Wilson played in an offense that wasn't catered to him, while Hill gets every opportunity to showcase his skill and pad his stats.

I suspect Wilson will have a great 2015.

[SoCalPat]

I think part of his point was that Hill's stats are inflated by the number of mid majors he plays against. Hard to compare his overall stats with Wilson's when Wilson is playing one of the toughest schedules in the nation.

He could have also mentioned that Wilson played in an offense that wasn't catered to him, while Hill gets every opportunity to showcase his skill and pad his stats.

I suspect Wilson will have a great 2015.

Meh. In 2013, Utah's SOS per Sagarin was 3rd. BYU's was 38th, which was right in line with most of the Big 12 and was the fourth-rated conference per Sagarin and a tougher SOS than just about every team in the ACC and Big 10.

[wally]

I'm not as upset about the possession of alcohol by a minor as I am that he was at a Tim McGraw concert.

Now, typing this on my phone I'm upset that the predictive typing function had 'McGraw' properly capitalized and in there.

You hit the nail on the head. This is the real reason Wilson was not elected a captain last year, IMO. How can anyone vote for anybody that goes to a McGraw concert?

[wally]

One, if their numbers are equal, either Hill is not a heisman contender or Wilson is. You can't have it both ways.

I was joking about the heisman thing. sorry if that wasn't obvious.


Two, the Tim McGraw concert? Come one, we are better than that. KVN received a DUI. That didn't prove anything on the field. The McGraw concert is completely 100% irrelevant.

Joking about this too, except for the fact that Tim McGraw sucks.


Three, Wilson has beaten top 10 teams. Hill has beat a Texas team that was ranked 15, but ended the year unranked. Stanford ended the year #5.

Point to me which top ten team we beat on offensive merit and moreover on the merits of Wilson's quarterbacking abilities. We won on defense. Conversely, BYU's defense leaked like a sieve and victories were to be had by the offense, which was mostly Hill. If Hill hadn't been injured, BYU would have likely played a decent bowl opponent and had a shot to prove themselves there.


Again, I'm not sure I'm trading Hill for Wilson. Other than a couple of highlights (BTW, I can show just as many hurdling highlight of Wilson), what is the difference between two average QB's?

When Hill hurdled opponents though, he mostly landed on his feet not his face.


There is a reason why Stanford wanted to move Hill to safety, and why Hill then transferred to BYU. He is an average QB with no chance at the NFL as a QB.

Right now, today, Wilson is still the better NFL prospect. Wilson could come out, have a huge year and get drafted. Hill probably won't, because he can't pass worth a crap. Hill is a really, really poor man's Tebow. Wilson could come out and have a year like Osweiler's SR year. Probably won't happen, but it has a better chance of happening than Hill suddenly becoming an NFL QB.

I forget are we talking about Utah competing in the PAC-12 or winning the Super Bowl? Didn't Tebow win a national championship? I think that I'd go ahead and take Tebow right now over Hill or Wilson. College is not the Pros, bro.

I get that we are Utes and that we are supposed to hate BYU, but dammit, I am just too intellectually honest to go trying to convince myself that Hill is just a rubbish QB!

BTW, I do like Wilson, but I would still make the trade!

[sancho]

If Hill hadn't been injured, BYU would have likely played a decent bowl opponent and had a shot to prove themselves there.


Is that true? I thought they were locked into the Miami bowl no matter what (unless they were picked to a NY6 bowl, which was not happening).

[Utah]

Is that true? I thought they were locked into the Miami bowl no matter what (unless they were picked to a NY6 bowl, which was not happening).

BYU was going to play in a crap bowl no matter what.

Wally - I love how excuses are made for Hill but not Wilson. We were 4-2 and beat a top 5 team when Wilson was hurt in 2013. How different would 2013 gone if Wilson had not been hurt? He couldn't grip a football the rest of the year. We go bowling with a healthy Wilson.

Why is Hill given every excuse, when he plays a weak schedule (and please don't compare a schedule playing 4 P5 teams to one playing 9+. BYU's schedule is weak) and has an offense that is tailored to his strengths.

Why is Wilson thrown under the bus when he plays hurt, beats top 10 teams, leads us on game winning drives, takes us from a 14 point swing because of Clay to battle back in the game, all while playing for an OC that doesn't want him starting?

Hill has been given everything, and yet isn't any better than Wilson.

And don't give me the "I know a QB when I see one" bs. You sound like BYU fan proclaiming Jake Heaps dominance over the world. Yeah, Hill looks nice. I'm not here to win a swimsuit contest. I want results. And the facts are, both produce eerily the same. Wilson is a better passer. Hill is a better runner.

[sancho]

"I know a QB when I see one" bs.

The eye test means more than statistics with QBs. I like Wilson. He's had some great moments - Stanford '13, USC '14 are the two that I remember best. He's had to play against the best. He's had to deal with injury. He's never been paired with a good WR corp. I just think Hill is better.

[utefan]

The eye test means more than statistics with QBs. I like Wilson. He's had some great moments - Stanford '13, USC '14 are the two that I remember best. He's had to play against the best. He's had to deal with injury. He's never been paired with a good WR corp. I just think Hill is better.
I remember Hill with around a 30% completion rate a couple years ago, until the schedule softened up and then his numbers suddenly got better.

The guy runs like the wind, no doubt. But with time running out and needing a touchdown to win against a great USC defense, I'd rather have Wilson leading the drive.

With time running out and needing a score to tie (or win) against a great Stanford defense, I'd rather have Wilson than Hill.

The level of competition they're each playing against is just not comparable. I'm sure Wilson would look great against a bunch of Mountain West teams. He sure looked great against Fresno State and Colorado State. And that was with a nightmare OC in charge of the offense.

Let's see what happens in 2015 before we declare Hill to be better. I expect a great season from Wilson.

[sancho]

I expect a great season from Wilson.

So do I. Especially after seeing that graduation photo LA posted. TW looks like a guy about to take over.

[wally]

The eye test means more than statistics with QBs. I like Wilson. He's had some great moments - Stanford '13, USC '14 are the two that I remember best. He's had to play against the best. He's had to deal with injury. He's never been paired with a good WR corp. I just think Hill is better.

I agree.

Tell you what, we have the entire 2015 season to see which QB ends their career with better production. Both teams face pretty tough schedules this time. Utah faces the tougher schedule, but BYU's is nowhere near as light as last year. I hope Both QBs stay healthy, and if I end up being wrong and Wilson just lights up our competition, and Hill tanks, I will come eat crow.

[USS Utah]

Football stats are mostly meaningless. I know by the eye test that Hill is the better QB. I'm okay with that. I like our QB a lot, and I think we are better than BYU in pretty much every other position except maybe TE and WR.

Hill is a better QB? Really? Hill is a great runner . . . and that's it.

I want more than a great runner at QB.

[USS Utah]

I honestly don't get the hype for Hill, here or anywhere else. Like I said, he is a great runner, but Stewart was a better QB than Hill is. Utah State had a couple of QBs better than Hill is.

I won't say Wilson is a better QB, but I think an argument can be made that he is better that he is given credit for being.

[sancho]

Hill is a better QB? Really? Hill is a great runner . . . and that's it.

I want more than a great runner at QB.

Alright. Majority rules. I will no longer make the trade!

[wally]

Post Spring training NCAA Footbal Power Rankings: http://www.si.com/college-football/2015/05/14/post-spring-practice-college-football-top-25-power-rankings

Guess who comes in at #23?

A clue: the only local team with the legit Heisman candidate at QB.

[sancho]

Post Spring training NCAA Footbal Power Rankings: http://www.si.com/college-football/2015/05/14/post-spring-practice-college-football-top-25-power-rankings

Guess who comes in at #23?

A clue: the only local team with the legit Heisman candidate at QB.

Booooo!!!!

I would really be happy with an 0-4 start, but every one of those four teams has some pretty big question marks going into this season. 4-0 would be a nightmare. Even 3-1 would be pretty lousy.


UCLA - new starter at QB
Boise - lost Ajayi and OC Sanford
Nebraska - has been consistently bad for a long time, plus new coach, plus new RB, plus no QB
Michigan - has been pretty bad for a few years, who knows with new coach though

[USS Utah]

Post Spring training NCAA Footbal Power Rankings: http://www.si.com/college-football/2015/05/14/post-spring-practice-college-football-top-25-power-rankings

Guess who comes in at #23?

A clue: the only local team with the legit Heisman candidate at QB.

So what? Utah has a legit Heisman candidate at RB.

[sancho]

So what? Utah has a legit Heisman candidate at RB.

Yes, and frankly, ours is cooler.

[utefan]

Yes, and frankly, ours is cooler.
Ours is the only legit Heisman candidate in the state.

[LA Ute]

Ours is the only legit Heisman candidate in the state.

DB does have a full season of high-level success behind him.

[sancho]

Ours is the only legit Heisman candidate in the state.

Saying DB has a better shot at the Heisman than TH is like saying Robert Downey is more likely to win "Best Actor" for the Avengers than Jeremy Renner.

[DrumNFeather]

Saying DB has a better shot at the Heisman than TH is like saying Robert Downey is more likely to win "Best Actor" for the Avengers than Jeremy Renner.

1460

[SoCalPat]

Anyone who truly believes Devontae Booker is a legit Heisman contender just isn't paying attention. RBs don't win this award unless they have absurd single-season/career stats (Barry Sanders, Ricky Williams, Ron Dayne) or they play for a national title contender (Reggie Bush, Mark Ingram). QBs have much more margin of error. RGIII and Tim Tebow won their Heismans in years their teams lost three regular season games. Manziel and Carson Palmer's teams lost two games apiece.

So saying Booker is a Heisman candidate is doubling down on hype -- you're not only propping him as someone capable of rushing for well over 2,000 yards, but you're in effect saying Utah is a national title contender. Today, the Heisman doesn't go to RBs who rush for 1,700 yards on teams that go 9-3. The last Heisman RB winner who didn't have the absurd stats and whose team was DOA in the national title picture on Nov. 1? Bo Jackson. And Auburn lost to Alabama that year, went 8-3 in the regular season and Jackson's margin of victory over Chuck Long (Iowa QB) was the narrowest in Heisman history at the time.

Winning the Doak Walker award is a tremendous honor and a more realistic goal/aspiration for Booker and Utah fans than winning the Heisman. If we're 6-1 or better after USC, I'll jump on the Heisman bandwagon. But the moment Utah loses its second game, Booker is done as a serious Heisman candidate. That moment won't do anything to hinder his Walker chances, however. He can win the award with an 1,800-yard season and with Utah finishing anywhere from 10-2 to 8-4. If we're really lucky, maybe he gets a trip to NYC as a finalist. Maybe.

[FountainOfUte]

Pat, I agree in the sense that I don't think he's going to *win* the Heisman. I think we all know that already. But I think he's as legit a contender as anyone as of today. He's one of the most exciting and talented RBs coming back from last season, which I think is enough to put him in the discussion of "guys to watch" in a Heisman context today.

I'd LOVE to see him bring home the Walker. That would be fantastic. And I agree, I think that's a FAR more likely outcome to hope for.

[LA Ute]

Pat: I'm paying attention! Trust me on that! I'm proud DB is a legit Heisman candidate. I don't think he'll win it (barring a magical Utah season that no one here is predicting or even hoping for).

[SoCalPat]

Pat, I agree in the sense that I don't think he's going to *win* the Heisman. I think we all know that already. But I think he's as legit a contender as anyone as of today. He's one of the most exciting and talented RBs coming back from last season, which I think is enough to put him in the discussion of "guys to watch" in a Heisman context today.

I'd LOVE to see him bring home the Walker. That would be fantastic. And I agree, I think that's a FAR more likely outcome to hope for.

There are six RBs in P5 returning in 2015 that put up better numbers last year than Booker. One of them -- Paul Perkins -- plays in the Pac-12. The only one of those six who is going to garner overwhelming Heisman buzz is Ezekiel Elliott. Maybe Nick Chubb sneaks in there -- he plays in the SEC after all. And the Oklahoma kid who ran for an FBS record for yards in a game (a record he held for all of one week) probably gets some buzz. I think everyone else is an afterthought. It would be a pleasant surprise to see any national CFB media personality east of the Mississippi mention Devontae and Heisman in the same sentence. Once.

Truth be told, when it comes to national honors as prestigious as the Heisman, we're viewed much much closer to G5 status than P5.

[LA Ute]

There are six RBs in P5 returning in 2015 that put up better numbers last year than Booker.

Those guys played full seasons in 2014, I assume. I don't think Booker started until the 3rd or 4th game of the season. So comparisons need to take that into account. Also, according to Phil Steele, Utah's 2015 schedule will be 8th toughest in the nation -- but only the 4th toughest in the PAC-12. So if DB does well against that competition he is going to have an argument to make for some post-season honors.

[utefan]

Anyone who truly believes Devontae Booker is a legit Heisman contender just isn't paying attention. RBs don't win this award unless they have absurd single-season/career stats (Barry Sanders, Ricky Williams, Ron Dayne) or they play for a national title contender (Reggie Bush, Mark Ingram). QBs have much more margin of error. RGIII and Tim Tebow won their Heismans in years their teams lost three regular season games. Manziel and Carson Palmer's teams lost two games apiece.

So saying Booker is a Heisman candidate is doubling down on hype -- you're not only propping him as someone capable of rushing for well over 2,000 yards, but you're in effect saying Utah is a national title contender. Today, the Heisman doesn't go to RBs who rush for 1,700 yards on teams that go 9-3. The last Heisman RB winner who didn't have the absurd stats and whose team was DOA in the national title picture on Nov. 1? Bo Jackson. And Auburn lost to Alabama that year, went 8-3 in the regular season and Jackson's margin of victory over Chuck Long (Iowa QB) was the narrowest in Heisman history at the time.

Winning the Doak Walker award is a tremendous honor and a more realistic goal/aspiration for Booker and Utah fans than winning the Heisman. If we're 6-1 or better after USC, I'll jump on the Heisman bandwagon. But the moment Utah loses its second game, Booker is done as a serious Heisman candidate. That moment won't do anything to hinder his Walker chances, however. He can win the award with an 1,800-yard season and with Utah finishing anywhere from 10-2 to 8-4. If we're really lucky, maybe he gets a trip to NYC as a finalist. Maybe.
Will Booker win the Heisman? Probably not. Are his chances much, MUCH better than Hill's? Absofreakinlutely.

Say what you want about RBs having a slim chance, but as slim as those chances are they're still orders of magnitude better than any g5 player. Especially if the g5 player isn't all that great anyway and the g5 team is pretty mediocre.

Hill runs like the wind, but he's not a great qb.

[jrj84105]

C'mon. Booker isn't even the top Heisman candidate on the team.

Tom Hackett all the way.

[U-Ute]

LOL

http://www.mwcconnection.com/2015/6/13/8776273/mountain-west-football-the-16-best-teams-in-conference-history

:rolleyes:

[LA Ute]

LOL

http://www.mwcconnection.com/2015/6/13/8776273/mountain-west-football-the-16-best-teams-in-conference-history

:rolleyes:

Perfect. Just perfect.


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[chrisrenrut]

LOL

http://www.mwcconnection.com/2015/6/13/8776273/mountain-west-football-the-16-best-teams-in-conference-history

:rolleyes:

Seems like a very scientific poll. You can't argue with science.

[sancho]

Seems like a very scientific poll. You can't argue with science.

It is the chief characteristic of the religion of science that it works.

Asimov, Foundation.

[wally]

Makes me feel really bad for BYU fans that they are trolling around the MWC websites when they aren't even in the MWC anymore. It's gotta be lonely, kinda like those 19 year olds that still hang around at high school functions.

I hope they find a home soon. :(

[DrumNFeather]

Makes me feel really bad for BYU fans that they are trolling around the MWC websites when they aren't even in the MWC anymore. It's gotta be lonely, kinda like those 19 year olds that still hang around at high school functions.

I hope they find a home soon. :(

"And I'm peaked in the MWC BYU, and I have cable."

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/B9xFGj2CcAAf9lr.jpg

[SoCalPat]

Seems like a very scientific poll. You can't argue with science.

In response to the original tweet made on Twitter about this poll, I replied that no TCU team could hold a candle to 2004 Utah, which was clearly the better team at every position save LB. No one took the bait. TCU fans are the anti-BYU in terms of internet presence -- they're probably not out there and they certainly aren't making themselves heard.

[Ma'ake]

Coug Nation is officially depressed.

Dick Harmon puts out a column saying that current and former players are praising the offseason workouts, and the consensus response seems to be "where have we heard this before?"

They're already arguing with each on whether Bronco should be fired if they lose their game against us... next year.

We'll see a compound effect in September, unless they somehow go 3-1. Going 2-2 or 1-3 will bring on highly amplified mass anger, the kind that will turn away the casual fans and cause one of the General Authorities to give a lecture about the damaging effects of anger, or whatever.

(I've never seen them this way, in June. Usually by now they've shaken off any doubts and are starting to work themselves into an irrational frenzy of hallucinogenic expectations.)

It's starting to remind me of an acquaintance's situation with his Ex, where one night the woman had worked herself into a drunken fury, and decided to give her former husband a piece of her mind, drove over to his house, sloshed, and started screaming at him on his (new) front lawn... in her night gown.

[sancho]

. Going 2-2 or 1-3 will bring on highly amplified mass anger

I think most BYU fans would be happy with a 2-2 start. In fact, I best most would take it right now if offered.

[NorthwestUteFan]

Who could they possibly get who would be an improvement over Bronco?

The FB coach works within a quirky recruiting situation.

The fanbase has highly unrealistic expectations.

The coach not only needs to be LDS, he needs to be über LDS. Every coaching staff meeting must be run like a high-level church meeting. Everything begins and ends with a prayer, of course, but it goes even deeper than that. They believe the program and school represents something greater than any other football program in the nation, and that God will bless them with success on the field because that is part of building the Kingdom of the Lord on earth. So the coach must also be an apocalyptic evangelical in many ways, all while maintaining the auspices of a mainstream LDS member in lock step with SLC.

The fanbase again will yell "The Church is true!" when the team is winning, but will scream "The Coach has failed Heavenly Father!" when the team loses.

It seems impossible to find somebody who fits this profile, and who will also put the team in position to win 7-10 games per season. Finding a high-quality coach who is LDS, possesses the football skills, and will be willing to work under those conditions is a scary proposition.

I hope that if Bronco gets fired, he goes in to have success at a normal school while his replacement takes them to new depths of despair in Provostan.

[U-Ute]

Who could they possibly get who would be an improvement over Bronco?

I think BYU fans are starting to realize how lucky they were in the 80's with LaVell. It really was a perfect storm for them.

1. A passing offense when everyone else was running wishbone.
2. A weak conference.
3. Predating the internet and cell phone cameras.

Since LaVell's departure, they have collectively been in the Denial stage are now starting to transition into Anger. I'll be interesting to see what happens with respect to recruiting and the Honor Code when they hit Bargaining.

I'm thinking of putting together a business proposal to open a Diet Coke and Ice Cream shop in Provo for when they hit Depression. Anyone want in on the ground floor?

[Ma'ake]

Since LaVell's departure, they have collectively been in the Denial stage and are now starting to transition into Anger.

The anger stage is definitely in full bloom. In previous BYU football media days, they were completely enamored by the H-Def TV trailer and were giddy about how their rightful return as a college football elite was apparently underway. Today, Cougarboard seems more angry right now at the Big-12 than they were at Larry Scott and the PAC-12, 5 years ago.

The terms "Big-12" and "idiots" are getting paired in the same sentences at a "rate that's not conducive to a successful courtship".

[Senioritis]

I heard Bob Anae being interviewed on the radio yesterday. He sounds like Wilford Brimley. Made me crave some Quaker Maple & Brown Sugar.

[sancho]

I heard Bob Anae being interviewed on the radio yesterday. He sounds like Wilford Brimley. Made me crave some Quaker Maple & Brown Sugar.

He's the best coach on their staff. The only one I would want in any capacity at the U. I was loving it when they fired him.

[Senioritis]

He's the best coach on their staff. The only one I would want in any capacity at the U. I was loving it when they fired him.

Should he ever be on staff at the U, I'd start a petition to have him grow a massive Walrustache and dispense folksy wisdom on the jumbotron at the beginning of the fourth quarter in place of the taiko drum.

[Dwight Schr-Ute]

Should he ever be on staff at the U, I'd start a petition to have him grow a massive Walrustache and dispense folksy wisdom on the jumbotron at the beginning of the fourth quarter in place of the taiko drum.

We could have really used him to narrate that awesome muscle car video we made.

[jrj84105]

My favorite part of the Beach Brawl is that Anae is laughing the whole time.

[wally]

I heard Bob Anae being interviewed on the radio yesterday. He sounds like Wilford Brimley. Made me crave some Quaker Maple & Brown Sugar.

I am more of a apple cinnamon guy, but hey, to each his own. I tried some Quaker oatmeal "cinnabon" flavor once. Pretty good too.

[wally]

My favorite part of the Beach Brawl is that Anae is laughing the whole time.

I did not notice this. That is pretty cool.

You know, i think that the Beach Brawl was pretty benign. Not at all a big deal. Stuff happens. Now the part that I'd be most embarrassed about (if I was a coug) is the fact that BYU lost that brawl pretty handily. Like, they lost the brawl WAY worse than they lost the game.

If Anae's generation had brawled, they would not not have embarrassed themselves like that.

[Dwight Schr-Ute]

This got Tweeted out by one of BYU's coaches yesterday. http://images.tapatalk-cdn.com/15/06/28/4088d1c0eaead3abb69ca11356ec967a.jpg

Seems like Tujague needs to take a wildlife identification class. But if you're going to intentionally compare yourself to an African lion, it's probably better (although less appropriate in this scenario) to go with the male version.

[NorthwestUteFan]

Rise and Shout! The Lionesses are out!

[Ma'ake]

BYU fans are now angry that Boise State coach Bryan Harsin thinks the Broncos would be a good fit for the Big-12.

This is like watching the tension and jealousy building among standby passengers for a flight, as the gate area gets empty because everyone else is on the plane.

[concerned]

just saw a story that ESPN is losing subscribers and is in major cost cutting mode, including dismissing Olbermann, and scrapping a plan to move Mike & Mike to NYC. Said Mike Tirico, Colin Cowherd and others could be in for it when their contracts come up for renewal.

Remember how ESPN played hardball with the MWC in renewal negotiations that basically forced the MWC to start the Mountain?

If I were the Y I might be worried about what ESPN will do when their contract comes up for renewal. ESPN has all the leverage.

[Hot Lunch]

just saw a story that ESPN is losing subscribers and is in major cost cutting mode, including dismissing Olbermann, and scrapping a plan to move Mike & Mike to NYC. Said Mike Tirico, Colin Cowherd and others could be in for it when their contracts come up for renewal.

Remember how ESPN played hardball with the MWC in renewal negotiations that basically forced the MWC to start the Mountain?

If I were the Y I might be worried about what ESPN will do when their contract comes up for renewal. ESPN has all the leverage.

Nah, ESPN needs them. ESPN is in BYU's back pocket. That truck, they have that HD Truck.

[Diehard Ute]

just saw a story that ESPN is losing subscribers and is in major cost cutting mode, including dismissing Olbermann, and scrapping a plan to move Mike & Mike to NYC. Said Mike Tirico, Colin Cowherd and others could be in for it when their contracts come up for renewal.

Remember how ESPN played hardball with the MWC in renewal negotiations that basically forced the MWC to start the Mountain?

If I were the Y I might be worried about what ESPN will do when their contract comes up for renewal. ESPN has all the leverage.

Saw a story last week indicating Disney has ordered $100,000,000 in cost cuts next year and $250,000,000 in 2017.

ESPN costs cable and satellite providers $6 or more. Compared to $1.50 for TNT, TBS etc.

Disney is also concerned that ESPN is cutting the advertising their other networks get so they can add more outside advertising (ESPN slashed the number of Disney owned company commercials by 75% in the NBA finals)

Going to be interesting to watch, as the "big" sports get more expensive it would seem things like individual school contracts will go the way of the dinosaur. Also makes you wonder how the SEC network may be affected.


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[UtahsMrSports]

just saw a story that ESPN is losing subscribers and is in major cost cutting mode, including dismissing Olbermann, and scrapping a plan to move Mike & Mike to NYC. Said Mike Tirico, Colin Cowherd and others could be in for it when their contracts come up for renewal.

Remember how ESPN played hardball with the MWC in renewal negotiations that basically forced the MWC to start the Mountain?

If I were the Y I might be worried about what ESPN will do when their contract comes up for renewal. ESPN has all the leverage.

http://www.wsj.com/articles/espn-tightens-its-belt-as-pressure-on-it-mounts-1436485852

Very very interesting read.

My first question is why Beadle, Schefter, and Tirico instead of Brainless, Smith, and Broussard?

[Ma'ake]

Right now live sports are the only reason I hang on to cable, like many others.

I know lots and LOTS of people who've abandoned cable and phone service, going with internet only, with Hulu, Netflix, etc. This is just the first wave. As soon as somebody solves the live sports broadcast issue in a good way, cable revenues are going to plummet.

There was an article about how the music industry went from about $12 Billion a year to about $7 Billion a year, as customers download individual songs now instead of whole albums, the iTunes phenomenon (after the Napster earthquake). Artists have gone from using concerts to promote records, to now using recordings to promote concerts, but over all, the money in music is way, waaay down.

[Diehard Ute]

Right now live sports are the only reason I hang on to cable, like many others.

I know lots and LOTS of people who've abandoned cable and phone service, going with internet only, with Hulu, Netflix, etc. This is just the first wave. As soon as somebody solves the live sports broadcast issue in a good way, cable revenues are going to plummet.

There was an article about how the music industry went from about $12 Billion a year to about $7 Billion a year, as customers download individual songs now instead of whole albums, the iTunes phenomenon (after the Napster earthquake). Artists have gone from using concerts to promote records, to now using recordings to promote concerts, but over all, the money in music is way, waaay down.

As an aside it's kind of funny. Lars Ulrich (and Metallica) still take heat for their part in getting rid of Napster because artists received nothing.

Last month Taylor Swift was praised as a hero for blasting apple for proposing no compensation to artists for their 3 month Apple music trial. My how times have changed haha


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[LA Ute]

Right now live sports are the only reason I hang on to cable, like many others.

I know lots and LOTS of people who've abandoned cable and phone service, going with internet only, with Hulu, Netflix, etc. This is just the first wave. As soon as somebody solves the live sports broadcast issue in a good way, cable revenues are going to plummet.

There was an article about how the music industry went from about $12 Billion a year to about $7 Billion a year, as customers download individual songs now instead of whole albums, the iTunes phenomenon (after the Napster earthquake). Artists have gone from using concerts to promote records, to now using recordings to promote concerts, but over all, the money in music is way, waaay down.

We have Dish and are increasingly asking ourselves why. We only watch certain channels, never use the pay-per-view movies, don't have HBO, Showtime, etc., and as with you, sports are the main reason we hang on. The DVR is nice too, for things we want to see post-broadcast. We are using Netflix, Amazon Prime, and Hulu. Times are changing.

[Solon]

We have Dish and are increasingly asking ourselves why. We only watch certain channels, never use the pay-per-view movies, don't have HBO, Showtime, etc., and as with you, sports are the main reason we hang on. The DVR is nice too, for things we want to see post-broadcast. We are using Netflix, Amazon Prime, and Hulu. Times are changing.

We hold onto Dish only for the Pac-12 network. If one of these networks had the guts to offer online-only subscriptions (as opposed to the current requirement that I have hardware at my house before I can watch online), I would sign up in a heartbeat. Most people I meet under 30 years of age are waiting for the same thing.

[Ma'ake]

We hold onto Dish only for the Pac-12 network. If one of these networks had the guts to offer online-only subscriptions (as opposed to the current requirement that I have hardware at my house before I can watch online), I would sign up in a heartbeat. Most people I meet under 30 years of age are waiting for the same thing.

Fascinating time. I'd bet the content producers - conferences, teams, production crews - are carefully sifting through the numbers to decide when it makes sense to simply offer games via online, for a fee. My hunch is the big boys are still making lots of money getting people to buy bundles where its impossible to watch everything provided.

What is the per customer revenue of a PAC game through whatever network vs just charging $10 for the game? Many customers aren't engaged enough to evaluate these purchasing decisions, but at younger, less affluent customers join the market, that will chance.

I'm sure it's wrapped up in contracts, but when does the PAC-12 stop playing the DirectTV chicanery and just offer online, their own servers, etc? Maybe price it in a way that doesn't submarine the distribution partners.

I'm having a hard time thinking this current situation will last 5 years. Some producer will bust out, prove it's economically viable, and then all hell breaks loose for the big boys and the distribution partners.

[sancho]

I've seen hulu, Netflix, and prime, and there's very little that's worth watching. It's still hard for me to believe that this is tv's golden age.

I can't imagine a system where I can get all the different sports I want online through a dozen different subscriptions for less money than I pay comcast now. I watch soccer, football, basketball, and baseball.

Take just college football alone. On a Saturday, I may flip between espn, abc, nbc, Fox, pac12, big10, cbs, cbssports, espn2. Am I really going to get all of those individually for less than the $50 a month I give comcast?

[Ma'ake]

I've seen hulu, Netflix, and prime, and there's very little that's worth watching. It's still hard for me to believe that this is tv's golden age.

I can't imagine a system where I can get all the different sports I want online through a dozen different subscriptions for less money than I pay comcast now. I watch soccer, football, basketball, and baseball.

Take just college football alone. On a Saturday, I may flip between espn, abc, nbc, Fox, pac12, big10, cbs, cbssports, espn2. Am I really going to get all of those individually for less than the $50 a month I give comcast?

You're exactly right, but as soon as somebody solves the live sports puzzle for online-only, it will be a dam burst. Everything else is going that way. Fast.

2-5 years, is my hunch.

[concerned]

You're exactly right, but as soon as somebody solves the live sports puzzle for online-only, it will be a dam burst. Everything else is going that way. Fast.

2-5 years, is my hunch.

Which I suspect will burst the bubble on college TV contracts. Might be a lot less money when subscribers aren't forced to buy a package.

[Rocker Ute]

We hold onto Dish only for the Pac-12 network. If one of these networks had the guts to offer online-only subscriptions (as opposed to the current requirement that I have hardware at my house before I can watch online), I would sign up in a heartbeat. Most people I meet under 30 years of age are waiting for the same thing.

Check out sling TV, $20 and you get ESPN etc. we cut the cord about 3 years ago now. At the time it wasn't intended to be long term, I was just tired of Comcast monkey business so we shut it down and got a Netflix subscription.

I haven't looked back at all. I don't watch a lot of TV, neither does my wife but the real beauty is with kids. You start a show whenever you want, no commercials and then when the show is done they go and do something different, 23 minutes of TV time and they are done. Regular TV you have the commercials and then another show comes on and they just keep sitting there.

Maake is right, fix the live sports thing (which is done, it just needs to be unhitched from regular TV subscriptions) and it is over.

The funniest thing is for my youngest. She has no concept of a world where TV shows aren't in demand. We were traveling and in a hotel and she says that she wants to watch Mickey's Clubhouse. I say to her, "It is not on right now." That was as foreign of a concept to her as anything. She thought I was just being mean and not letting her watch her show.

Also being commercial free now, when I watch regular TV I really notice how intense, loud and fast-paced commercials are. I feel like when those Russians defected and struggled to buy cereal in the grocery store because it was info overload.

[NorthwestUteFan]

The Slingtv + ESPN package for $20+$5 is intriguing. It is particularly effective if you aren't tied to Comcast for internet service.

But as stated above they need to work out a situation that still funds the leagues. I don't think I would like a direct PPV situation, because while I would directly pay for all of the Utah games I do not want to pay to watch 10 minutes of another game of interest. I want to watch the game-winning drive at the end of some random team like Georgia, without buying the game directly.

If we could get a package with CBS, ABC, ESPN, Fox1, NFL, PAC-12, B1G, SEC, etc, for an affordable price (absolutely needs to be under $30/mo total) and enough people buy it, then it can easily work but right now ESPN has huge market penetration for $6/subscriber/mo. Would they make it work for $20/mo with significantly fewer subscribers? Who knows.

NBC sports will be unlikely to go directly to streaming because they are owned by Comcast and that seems to not be in their best interest. But Comcast also owns NHL Network and MLB TV and both if those offer online streaming packages, so who really knows how it will shake out.

The bottom line for me right now is I can't see enough of a savings going to a streaming-only TV service. But that day is likely to come at some point. Maybe if Google Fiber can break the lock and give cheap streaming speed internet to the masses then we will finally see a revolution in sports content options.

[Solon]

Check out sling TV, $20 and you get ESPN etc. we cut the cord about 3 years ago now. At the time it wasn't intended to be long term, I was just tired of Comcast monkey business so we shut it down and got a Netflix subscription.

I haven't looked back at all. I don't watch a lot of TV, neither does my wife but the real beauty is with kids. You start a show whenever you want, no commercials and then when the show is done they go and do something different, 23 minutes of TV time and they are done. Regular TV you have the commercials and then another show comes on and they just keep sitting there.

Maake is right, fix the live sports thing (which is done, it just needs to be unhitched from regular TV subscriptions) and it is over.

The funniest thing is for my youngest. She has no concept of a world where TV shows aren't in demand. We were traveling and in a hotel and she says that she wants to watch Mickey's Clubhouse. I say to her, "It is not on right now." That was as foreign of a concept to her as anything. She thought I was just being mean and not letting her watch her show.

Also being commercial free now, when I watch regular TV I really notice how intense, loud and fast-paced commercials are. I feel like when those Russians defected and struggled to buy cereal in the grocery store because it was info overload.

Ha. My 3-year-old is the same way. The first time she saw a commercial, she thought the TV was broken.
i would do sling TV, but I need the Pac network. NEED, not want.

I read somewhere a theory that the reason Super Bowl 47 (Baltimore vs San Francisco) took a dip in ratings (the only Super Bowl in years to see a ratings dip from the previous year) wasn't due to decreased interest, but due to the fact that hometown fans in the Bay Area are techies and don't have traditional televisions. They watched it via mobile devices, and the ratings couldn't capture that number.

i used to live in PA, and Arlen Specter was my senator. He was working hard to dissolve the bundling practices of cable providers when he lost his position because he wasn't tea-party enough (he switched back to being a democrat, but it didn't work). He died in 2012, and I wish that issue would come up again.

[Rocker Ute]

I for the life of me cannot understand the resistance to streaming by the networks. This is the opportunity for them to expand their revenue stream like they never have before.

Streaming through the Internet would allow you to serve up contextual ads, just like the web. Then small and regional businesses can suddenly afford to advertise on TV directly to people interested in the product. That is access to a whole new and massive market (think google ads).

It also would allow for contextual ads during programming (think of ad bugs etc).

Now when I watch ESPN streaming they won't even show me the live TV ads, instead it will just tell me it is in commercial break. So stupid.

[sancho]

I for the life of me cannot understand the resistance to streaming by the networks. This is the opportunity for them to expand their revenue stream like they never have before.


I'm not so sure. I think they recognize it as the end of an even bigger revenue stream. They know a lot about making money, and there's a reason they're sticking with the plan.

I'm not terribly innovative, but I don't see how it can work.

[Rocker Ute]

I'm not so sure. I think they recognize it as the end of an even bigger revenue stream. They know a lot about making money, and there's a reason they're sticking with the plan.

I'm not terribly innovative, but I don't see how it can work.

Signed every newspaper in the world, the music industry, photography industry, book stores, taxi cab drivers, telephone industry, blockbuster video...

I do a lot of work in the real estate industry and they are doubling down on making access to info as difficult and proprietary as possible. It is hard to innovate when you are set in your ways and the entire industry is sitting there with blinders on about the realities of what will face them in the next decade. GenX and younger has zero patience for gatekeepers and having to wait on an individual for data that should be readily accessible.

TV industry is no different. They don't want to change because there current system works for them, but I'm already raising children who have no patience for that way of doing business. The reality is shifting if not already completely shifted whether they want to address it or not.

[sancho]

Signed every newspaper in the world, the music industry, photography industry, book stores, taxi cab drivers, telephone industry, blockbuster video...

I do a lot of work in the real estate industry and they are doubling down on making access to info as difficult and proprietary as possible. It is hard to innovate when you are set in your ways and the entire industry is sitting there with blinders on about the realities of what will face them in the next decade. GenX and younger has zero patience for gatekeepers and having to wait on an individual for data that should be readily accessible.

TV industry is no different. They don't want to change because there current system works for them, but I'm already raising children who have no patience for that way of doing business. The reality is shifting if not already completely shifted whether they want to address it or not.

I think we are agreeing. TV will hold on for as long as possible because they won't make as much under an internet model.

That said, I still have no idea how it will all work for me to get all the games I currently get for less money.

I'm with you on real estate. Why would I want to pay an agent in today's world?

[LA Ute]

Wow!!!

BYU football team gearing up for big games at big-time venues this fall (http://www.deseretnews.com/article/865632405/BYU-football-Cougars-gearing-up-for-big-games-at-storied-venues-this-fall.html)

[Dwight Schr-Ute]

Wow!!!

BYU football team gearing up for big games at big-time venues this fall (http://www.deseretnews.com/article/865632405/BYU-football-Cougars-gearing-up-for-big-games-at-storied-venues-this-fall.html)

Yeah. I remember Utah State did a lot of that when they were independent, as well.

[SoCalPat]

Wow!!!

BYU football team gearing up for big games at big-time venues this fall (http://www.deseretnews.com/article/865632405/BYU-football-Cougars-gearing-up-for-big-games-at-storied-venues-this-fall.html)



Opening the season at Nebraska? Big deal. We did that over 20 years ago.

[Dwight Schr-Ute]

Uhh. Did I miss something or are these guys making their annual climb to the cliff?

http://images.tapatalk-cdn.com/15/07/12/f535327300b95575e9e213afbeafe43b.jpg

[NorthwestUteFan]

It is just now getting weird? Where has that guy been for the last five years?

[UtahsMrSports]

Wow!!!

BYU football team gearing up for big games at big-time venues this fall (http://www.deseretnews.com/article/865632405/BYU-football-Cougars-gearing-up-for-big-games-at-storied-venues-this-fall.html)



I couldnt finish.

I think one of the big problems that leads to these annual delusions of grandeur is the fact that darn near every single person who "covers" BYU is a die-hard BYU fan, Jeff Call included. All of them are just puppets on Tom Holmoe's strings. The one guy who isn't is somewhat of a pot-stirrer (Jay Drew).

That home schedule blows. And its been horrible ever since they went independent. And yet, people buy into Tommy's claims that its going to be awesome!

Its a great day/week/month/year/time to be a Ute........

[SoCalPat]

I couldnt finish.

I think one of the big problems that leads to these annual delusions of grandeur is the fact that darn near every single person who "covers" BYU is a die-hard BYU fan, Jeff Call included. All of them are just puppets on Tom Holmoe's strings. The one guy who isn't is somewhat of a pot-stirrer (Jay Drew).

That home schedule blows. And its been horrible ever since they went independent. And yet, people buy into Tommy's claims that its going to be awesome!

Its a great day/week/month/year/time to be a Ute........

Pretty much spot on. BYU's 2013 home schedule was actually pretty damn good ... Texas, Utah, Boise State and Georgia Tech. If you woke me up and told me Utah was out of the Pac-12, but you put those four teams on the upcoming year's home slate, it would soften the blow somewhat.

The 2016 schedule has UCLA and Mississippi State, the 2019 schedule has Wisconsin, USC, Washington and Boise State. So by that metric, it appears BYU is having decent home schedules about once every three years. I think where BYU really misses the mark is the filler in their schedules -- instead of former rivals like Wyoming and New Mexico, they're playing UMass and FCS schools in November. I think we should play BYU every year, but I don't think we should be willing to help boost their late-season home slate. Screw them in that regard.

[Scratch]

Pretty much spot on. BYU's 2013 home schedule was actually pretty damn good ... Texas, Utah, Boise State and Georgia Tech. If you woke me up and told me Utah was out of the Pac-12, but you put those four teams on the upcoming year's home slate, it would soften the blow somewhat.

The 2016 schedule has UCLA and Mississippi State, the 2019 schedule has Wisconsin, USC, Washington and Boise State. So by that metric, it appears BYU is having decent home schedules about once every three years. I think where BYU really misses the mark is the filler in their schedules -- instead of former rivals like Wyoming and New Mexico, they're playing UMass and FCS schools in November. I think we should play BYU every year, but I don't think we should be willing to help boost their late-season home slate. Screw them in that regard.

This also kills them with the computers. Independent BYU hasn't been anywhere near good enough to have the computers matter, but if they do get to that point you get killed by having games against FCS and horrible FBS teams. The key is to get a win or two against top-25 teams and then have a schedule against a bunch of teams in the 40-60 range that you can reasonably expect to beat if you're a top-20 caliber team, but that won't kill you with the computers.

[Dwight Schr-Ute]

http://images.tapatalk-cdn.com/15/07/20/bbb4769ac72259f0b1f5da1b4fd12343.jpg

[LA Ute]

I am sure that for the BYU English department that float is a source of great frustraton.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Dwight Schr-Ute]

I am sure that for the BYU English department that float is a source of great frustraton.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

I 👀 what you did there.

[Diehard Ute]

I am sure that for the BYU English department that float is a source of great frustraton.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

There's no "I" 'n team or spellng at BYU.


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[SoCalPat]

Interesting pair of Final Jeopardy questions for regular Jeopardy and Sports Jeopardy this week.

Thursday night, on Jeopardy. The topic: Colleges and Universities

The mission of this western university founded in 1875 is "to assist individuals in their quest for perfection and eternal life."

Last week on Sports Jeopardy (airs weekly on the Crackle website). The topic: The Pac-12

The 2 schools that are the only Pac-12 schools in their states.

BYU may have gotten more "exposure" by being on Jeopardy, but we were featured on the sports show. Which, as we all know, triumphs over all.

[LA Ute]

I am moving this link to this thread because it belongs here. Listen at about 16:00. The interview is with Bill Plaschke of the L.A. times. You won't be sorry.

http://kfanav.s3.amazonaws.com/20150722_072215_bill-plaschke-WEB.mp3

Hat tip to Vegas Ute for posting this on another board where I saw it.

[sancho]

The 2 schools that are the only Pac-12 schools in their states.


At least until we add Boise, UNLV, Hawaii, and New Mexico!

[Ma'ake]

The interview is with Bill Plaschke of the L.A. times. You won't be sorry.

Really nice to hear his view from the 50,000 foot level, essentially confirming what we've been thinking and hoping for, for a long time.

His remarks about the USC game last year were really notable. Hearing about the impact of our game winning drive, from the LA perspective, really drove home how we've climbed into respectability in the PAC.

His comments about BYU were also interesting, because at this stage of his career, Plaschke has no need to spin anything any particular way - he's at the pinnacle of his profession, even giving Gordon a ribbing after Monson said he was the best sports journalist in America.

I think some of us have a little better insight into BYU's situation than Plaschke does, but he nicely conveyed the common national vibe that they're adrift and essentially at the mercy of a dysfunctional Big-12, their desperation getting stronger and more visible, it seems, on a weekly basis.

I half expect to see an article in the Deseret News about how three 8th grade girls in Missouri think it would be "really neat" if BYU was invited to the Big-12. "Besides, we like cats, too, and their players try hard and set a good example, but everyone has a hard time behaving when they go to Miami". Rich terrain for satire, for sure.

Even the BYU fans are starting to wish the D-News would move on to other topics. One poster said the BYU / Big-12 issue is starting to have a "stalker vibe", and suggested the Big-12 should get a restraining order against BYU. Hilarious.

[LA Ute]

Even the BYU fans are starting to wish the D-News would move on to other topics. One poster said the BYU / Big-12 issue is starting to have a "stalker vibe", and suggested the Big-12 should get a restraining order against BYU. Hilarious.

:rofl:

[Dwight Schr-Ute]

There was a debate on CB yesterday and out whether or not Utah had surpassed BYU in terms of stature and perception outside the state of Utah. Many of the responses insisted that BYU was discussed far more nationally than Utah. I didn't believe them until I took to Twitter, where it was confirmed. They do come up a lot.

http://images.tapatalk-cdn.com/15/07/24/e97742ba4cc9c27a32a898ef2e9b6bf0.jpg

[tooblue]

I am moving this link to this thread because it belongs here. Listen at about 16:00. The interview is with Bill Plaschke of the L.A. times. You won't be sorry.

http://kfanav.s3.amazonaws.com/20150722_072215_bill-plaschke-WEB.mp3

Hat tip to Vegas Ute for posting this on another board where I saw it.

Just a little tid bit for y'all. Since the NBA draft, on local sports radio, guess how many times I have personally heard an on-air personality etc. confused as to whether or not Delon Wright played at BYU ... after all, he comes out of Utah!

But hey, who am I to argue with a bombastic west coast reporter. Utah is the new Alabama! lol

[Scorcho]

Just a little tid bit for y'all. Since the NBA draft, on local sports radio, guess how many times I have personally heard an on-air personality etc. confused as to whether or not Delon Wright played at BYU ... after all, he comes out of Utah!

But hey, who am I to argue with a bombastic west coast reporter. Utah is the new Alabama! lol

i need to hear this, can you provide a link or two

as soon as they realize Wright is black, they'll realize he didn't got to the Y

;)

[Mormon Red Death]

Just a little tid bit for y'all. Since the NBA draft, on local sports radio, guess how many times I have personally heard an on-air personality etc. confused as to whether or not Delon Wright played at BYU ... after all, he comes out of Utah!

But hey, who am I to argue with a bombastic west coast reporter. Utah is the new Alabama! lol
Lol. .. what you are leaving out is that you are in Toronto. They only talk hockey and curling there.

[LA Ute]

Just a little tid bit for y'all. Since the NBA draft, on local sports radio, guess how many times I have personally heard an on-air personality etc. confused as to whether or not Delon Wright played at BYU ... after all, he comes out of Utah!

But hey, who am I to argue with a bombastic west coast reporter. Utah is the new Alabama! lol

It won't take long to put that confusion to rest.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[tooblue]

Lol. .. what you are leaving out is that you are in Toronto. They only talk hockey and curling there.

Just to be clear, this is what Toronto has produced in recent years:

Anthony Bennett
Tyler Ennis
Andrew Wiggins
Cory Joseph
Andrew Nicholson
Dwight Powell
Nik Stauskas

And don't kid a kidder ... you know exactly how outnumbered you are as a fan and in terms of awareness both in Michigan and North Carolina. LOL Utah, the new Alabama!

[mpfunk]

I am moving this link to this thread because it belongs here. Listen at about 16:00. The interview is with Bill Plaschke of the L.A. times. You won't be sorry.

http://kfanav.s3.amazonaws.com/20150722_072215_bill-plaschke-WEB.mp3

Hat tip to Vegas Ute for posting this on another board where I saw it.

I'm all for bashing on byu, but Plaschke is terrible. He is a bad writer and an idiot. I wouldn't use him to support a position even if he was right. There is a reason he was probably fjm.com favorite target.

Sent from my VS985 4G using Tapatalk

[LA Ute]

I'm all for bashing on byu, but Plaschke is terrible. He is a bad writer and an idiot. I wouldn't use him to support a position even if he was right. There is a reason he was probably fjm.com favorite target.

Sent from my VS985 4G using Tapatalk

Well, he has been the AP Sportswriter of the Year 5 times.

[sancho]

But hey, who am I to argue with a bombastic west coast reporter. Utah is the new Alabama! lol

I didn't listen to the interview, but from context, he doesn't say that Utah is the new anything. I think he's saying BYU is the new Akron or maybe SJSU.

[DrumNFeather]

I'm all for bashing on byu, but Plaschke is terrible. He is a bad writer and an idiot. I wouldn't use him to support a position even if he was right. There is a reason he was probably fjm.com favorite target.

Sent from my VS985 4G using Tapatalk

Most sports writers are terrible. That they're right at all is usually the exception, not the rule.

[LA Ute]

I didn't listen to the interview, but from context, he doesn't say that Utah is the new anything. I think he's saying BYU is the new Akron or maybe SJSU.

He says Utah is a great addition to the PAC-12. That makes him a man of great insight and judgment, IMO.

[Scorcho]

Just to be clear, this is what Toronto has produced in recent years:

Anthony Bennett
Tyler Ennis
Andrew Wiggins
Cory Joseph
Andrew Nicholson
Dwight Powell
Nik Stauskas

And don't kid a kidder ... you know exactly how outnumbered you are as a fan and in terms of awareness both in Michigan and North Carolina. LOL Utah, the new Alabama!

Utah local radio has podcasts and audio vaults of their content. It allows the listener to catch up or revisit a segment of the show.

Since Delon Wright has been incorrectly identified as player from the Lords University, could you give us a link so we could listen for ourselves. You hinted that it must have happened at least a dozen times.

Thanks in advance

[Scorcho]

Utah local radio has podcasts and audio vaults of their content. It allows the listener to catch up or revisit a segment of the show.

Since Delon Wright has been incorrectly identified as player from the Lords University, could you give us a link so we could listen for ourselves. You hinted that it must have happened at least a dozen times.

Thanks in advance


Here are the Toronto audio/articles if skimmed through so far .... nothing yet(they all reference the University of Utah), but I'll keep digging.

590 the fan
http://www.sportsnet.ca/basketball/nba/1-on-1-with-new-toronto-raptor-delon-wright/

Toronto 1050
http://www.tsn.ca/radio/toronto-1050/lewenberg-raptors-renewed-emphasis-on-defence-1.331478


Tip of the tower
http://tipofthetower.com/2015/07/04/delon-wright-signs-two-year-deal-with-toronto-raptors/


the Star
http://www.thestar.com/sports/raptors/2015/06/26/patience-paid-off-for-raptors-delon-wright.html

[tooblue]

Utah local radio has podcasts and audio vaults of their content. It allows the listener to catch up or revisit a segment of the show.

Since Delon Wright has been incorrectly identified as player from the Lords University, could you give us a link so we could listen for ourselves. You hinted that it must have happened at least a dozen times.

Thanks in advance

You can look up FAN 590 or TSN 1050 ... And interestingly, today I reffed mens league games. We got talking about the team Canada win over the US in the Pan Am games and Kentucky bound Jamal Murray's big night. We then got talking about Corey Joseph signing with the Raptors (I officiated a couple of his highschool games back when). I explained that I don't think he'll get much playing time ... If he couldn't compete with Patty Mills for playing time, he certainly isn't going to be able to compete with Wright. The response from one of the guys: "no way, those BYU guys out of Utah are stiffs."

I didn't have the energy to correct him. Lol Utah, the new Alabama!

[LA Ute]

You can look up FAN 590 or TSN 1050 ... And interestingly, today I reffed mens league games. We got talking about the team Canada win over the US in the Pan Am games and Kentucky bound Jamal Murray's big night. We then got talking about Corey Joseph signing with the Raptors (I officiated a couple of his highschool games back when). I explained that I don't think he'll get much playing time ... If he couldn't compete with Patty Mills for playing time, he certainly isn't going to be able to compete with Wright. The response from one of the guys: "no way, those BYU guys out of Utah are stiffs."

I didn't have the energy to correct him. Lol Utah, the new Alabama!

TB, why do you troll like this? It's a Utah board.

[tooblue]

TB, why do you troll like this? It's a Utah board.

I did have that conversation today. It was funny. One of the guys teammates did correct him ... One day I'll tell y'all about the guy who supposedly "played for Fisher at SDSU." He couldn't tell me a thing about any of his former conference (MWC) rivals or their arenas ... But This is a BYU thread LA!?

[LA Ute]

I did have that conversation today. It was funny. One of the guys teammates did correct him ... One day I'll tell y'all about the guy who supposedly "played for Fisher at SDSU." He couldn't tell me a thing about any of his former conference (MWC) rivals or their arenas ... But This is a BYU thread LA!?

Whatever. It's really no surprise that people think of LDS-related subjects when the State of Utah comes up, is it? The U. of U. doesn't have international folk dancers, is not owned and operated by a worldwide church with an apocalyptic worldwide mission to make every human being aware of its existence and mission, and a public relations operation to match that goal, etc., etc. So when people think of anything from Utah they think of the LDS church -- they also think of scary polygamists, the Osmonds, weird people, an arch-conservative legislature, the latest eccentric-seeming story from BYU, Steve Young, and so forth. So yes, many uninformed observers think of BYU when the subject of college athletes from Utah comes up. I guess you get a huge kick out of that. Many BYU fans do. Meanwhile we'll continue to enjoy our favorite university's success and progress.

[Jarid in Cedar]

Just a little tid bit for y'all. Since the NBA draft, on local sports radio, guess how many times I have personally heard an on-air personality etc. confused as to whether or not Delon Wright played at BYU ... after all, he comes out of Utah!

But hey, who am I to argue with a bombastic west coast reporter. Utah is the new Alabama! lol

They are just relieved to learn that Delon isn't from the same school as their last draft flop from the state of Utah. I understand their concern.

[tooblue]

Whatever. It's really no surprise that people think of LDS-related subjects when the State of Utah comes up, is it? The U. of U. doesn't have international folk dancers, is not owned and operated by a worldwide church with an apocalyptic worldwide mission to make every human being aware of its existence and mission, and a public relations operation to match that goal, etc., etc. So when people think of anything from Utah they think of the LDS church -- they also think of scary polygamists, the Osmonds, weird people, an arch-conservative legislature, the latest eccentric-seeming story from BYU, Steve Young, and so forth. So yes, many uninformed observers think of BYU when the subject of college athletes from Utah comes up. I guess you get a huge kick out of that. Many BYU fans do. Meanwhile we'll continue to enjoy our favorite university's success and progress.

These guys know nothing about LDS related subjects, let alone anything about BYU folk dancers. They do know sports. BYU is the national brand, which represents the state of Utah. What I find perplexing is the delusions of grandeur I now encounter among family and acquaintances. I often tune in to Utah sports radio, especially in the later summer build up to football season. They and Y'all speak as if Utah is the new Alabama. It's strange and not healthy IMO. I'm not trolling. I am simply pointing out the harsh reality of it all. But I'll leave the thread.

[tooblue]

They are just relieved to learn that Delon isn't from the same school as their last draft flop from the state of Utah. I understand their concern.

Without question. You have to remember, some genius in the Raptors front office wasted a top ten pick on Rafael Araujo.

[Scorcho]

You can look up FAN 590 or TSN 1050 ... And interestingly, today I reffed mens league games!

LOL those that can't do - teach and those that can't play ref.

Doesnt surprise me in the least that a BYU Fan would be reffing.

[tooblue]

LOL those that can't do - teach and those that can't play ref.

Doesnt surprise me in the least that a BYU Fan would be reffing.

What a burn, but guess what? I am also a teacher ... ooh double burn! lol lol lol lol lol

[LA Ute]

These guys know nothing about LDS related subjects, let alone anything about BYU folk dancers. They do know sports. BYU is the national brand, which represents the state of Utah. What I find perplexing is the delusions of grandeur I now encounter among family and acquaintances. I often tune in to Utah sports radio, especially in the later summer build up to football season. They and Y'all speak as if Utah is the new Alabama. It's strange and not healthy IMO. I'm not trolling. I am simply pointing out the harsh reality of it all. But I'll leave the thread.

This is the kind of 23 year-old smack we expect to see on CougarBoard.


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[Rocker Ute]

tooblue, this conversation reminds me of this little interaction between Homer Simpson and a recently divorced Kirk VanHousen, who is espousing the virtues of single life:

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=T1JO47zgtNU

You can have your race car bed (ie purported national brand).

[NorthwestUteFan]

You can have your race car bed (ie purported national brand).

Having a national brand is useful when it is positive. But when the national brand suggests every man, woman, or child to graduate from the school is an overhyped hack, or a stiff with an overly optimistic sense of self-importance, it is greatly counterproductive.

Unfortunately they seemingly lack the self-awareness to recognize their faults and take any constructive criticism of their abilities as a personal attack on their beliefs.

Besides, they lack the sufficiently impressive genitalia to justify their inflated sense of self-importance...

[hostile]

Reportedly an entry from the recent Pioneer Day parade
http://i1199.photobucket.com/albums/aa474/hawesjp/55DA75D7-07FC-4C6B-BA64-D4F0C3CDC201.jpg (http://s1199.photobucket.com/user/hawesjp/media/55DA75D7-07FC-4C6B-BA64-D4F0C3CDC201.jpg.html)

[NorthwestUteFan]

Reportedly an entry from the recent Pioneer Day parade




The National Brand in action!

[wally]

the national brand in act i on!

fify

[LA Ute]

The National Brand in action!

Get it right. The natonal brand in acton.

[Dwight Schr-Ute]

The National Band in action!

Given the things BYU is known for, I fixed it with a different spn.

[Viking]

I'm reluctant to say this, but, oh well. I follow the news and the posts on CB and CUF.

Many people know who I am and know what I do for a living. I am not an important person but I act on behalf of important people.

In 2011, these guys were certain of what the outcome would be. In my relative youth, I took their certainty to be fact, and it was wrong.

Today, no one knows what will happen. There are so many variables.

BYU, my beloved alma mater, could end up in the B12, P12 or end up in obscurity. I have no idea, and nor does anyone else I know, know. Anyone who says otherwise is extrapolating unsubstantiated conjecture.

What I hope? I hope BYU goes to the P12. What is most likely? B12. What might happen? Obscurity.

Deal with it.

Anything can happen; how can anyone claim to be enlightened when the truth is completely unlit and so many mutually exclusive variables are unclear? Not me. Not this time. We can speak in probabilities only, but not in certainties. Anyone else is a de facto pigskin shaman.

[LA Ute]

I'm reluctant to say this, but, oh well. I follow the news and the posts on CB and CUF.

Many people know who I am and know what I do for a living. I am not an important person but I act on behalf of important people.

In 2011, these guys were certain of what the outcome would be. In my relative youth, I took their certainty to be fact, and it was wrong.

Today, no one knows what will happen. There are so many variables.

BYU, my beloved alma mater, could end up in the B12, P12 or end up in obscurity. I have no idea, and nor does anyone else I know, know. Anyone who says otherwise is extrapolating unsubstantiated conjecture.

What I hope? I hope BYU goes to the P12. What is most likely? B12. What might happen? Obscurity.

Deal with it.

Anything can happen; how can anyone claim to be enlightened when the truth is completely unlit and so many mutually exclusive variables are unclear? Not me. Not this time. We can speak in probabilities only, but not in certainties. Anyone else is a de facto pigskin shaman.

I think you are right, Viking. EDIT: Except for the P12. I don't see that happening, ever.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[utefan]

I'm reluctant to say this, but, oh well. I follow the news and the posts on CB and CUF.

Many people know who I am and know what I do for a living. I am not an important person but I act on behalf of important people.

In 2011, these guys were certain of what the outcome would be. In my relative youth, I took their certainty to be fact, and it was wrong.

Today, no one knows what will happen. There are so many variables.

BYU, my beloved alma mater, could end up in the B12, P12 or end up in obscurity. I have no idea, and nor does anyone else I know, know. Anyone who says otherwise is extrapolating unsubstantiated conjecture.

What I hope? I hope BYU goes to the P12. What is most likely? B12. What might happen? Obscurity.

Deal with it.

Anything can happen; how can anyone claim to be enlightened when the truth is completely unlit and so many mutually exclusive variables are unclear? Not me. Not this time. We can speak in probabilities only, but not in certainties. Anyone else is a de facto pigskin shaman.
There is no chance BYU ends up in the Pac 12. None.

Not only is the Pac 12 happy with 12 with no intention to expand, but they've been crystal clear that they have absolutely no interest in BYU even if expansion was imminent.

[Dwight Schr-Ute]

This Jack Handy doTerra commercial is making the rounds. Mr. Pincock has just given me my new favorite reference to BYU. "Here at Division one football program."


https://youtu.be/mb3vDVDeSFo

[Scorcho]

Brett McMurphy ‏@McMurphyESPN (https://twitter.com/McMurphyESPN) 11h11 hours ago (https://twitter.com/McMurphyESPN/status/626447203230478336)
Kyle Whittingham was non-committal whether Utah will continue playing BYU after 2016-17: “Whatever is best for us"

https://twitter.com/mcmurphyespn

[Brian]

This Jack Handy doTerra commercial is making the rounds. Mr. Pincock has just given me my new favorite reference to BYU. "Here at Division on football program."


https://youtu.be/mb3vDVDeSFo

TDS or DOFB. Love it.

What a manly looking training facility they have down there with all the sweet scents, magical oils, and diffusers.
Eye cucumbers must be next.

[Rocker Ute]

Interesting endorsement from Division One Football Program®. How might I become a Wellness Advocate™?

[U-Ute]

TDS or DOFB. Love it.

What a manly looking training facility they have down there with all the sweet scents, magical oils, and diffusers.
Eye cucumbers must be next.


:clap:

[wally]

interesting endorsement from division one football program®. How might i become a wellness advocate™?

lol!

[Ma'ake]

Peeking in on the state of things on CB, I've never seen them in this bad of shape, at this point of the year.

The reality of their place in CFB is sinking in, the stakes have never been higher, they don't have the raw talent to believe they'll be able to have a great audition on the national stage - with even more spotlights on them - and it could be a blown season before they get to October.

By the 1st of August they usually have people making delusional predictions about their first few games, but right now it's like an Alcoholics Anonymous meeting with quite a few admitting their diminished interest, and what teams they'll root for if BYU never gets into a P5 conference, etc.

I almost feel bad for them.

Almost, but not quite.

[sancho]

Big10 will count BYU as P5 for scheduling. That makes all of the P5 conferences, I think.

Obviously, this is good news for BYU scheduling. They ought to be able to arrange 3-5 P5 games per year. I imagine their home schedules will benefit, as more P5 teams will agree to 1-1 deals. I don't know if their November schedule is ever going to be good, though.

[Sullyute]

Big10 will count BYU as P5 for scheduling. That makes all of the P5 conferences, I think.

Obviously, this is good news for BYU scheduling. They ought to be able to arrange 3-5 P5 games per year. I imagine their home schedules will benefit, as more P5 teams will agree to 1-1 deals. I don't know if their November schedule is ever going to be good, though.

Did the SEC change their mine? They had original said they would not count BYU as a P5, but I haven't paid attention lately.

[sancho]

Did the SEC change their mine? They had original said they would not count BYU as a P5, but I haven't paid attention lately.

You're probably right. I'm not keeping a list.

These conferences should add Boise State to the list. That program is 10x stronger than BYU.

[Sullyute]

You're probably right. I'm not keeping a list.

These conferences should add Boise State to the list. That program is 10x stronger than BYU.

A quick google search (http://espn.go.com/college-football/story/_/id/12514211/sec-count-games-independents-byu-army-notre-dame-power-5-commitment) says that they did change their mind...


Games against FBS independents BYU (http://espn.go.com/college-football/team/_/id/252/byu-cougars), Army (http://espn.go.com/college-football/team/_/id/349/army-black-knights) and Notre Dame (http://espn.go.com/college-football/team/_/id/87/notre-dame-fighting-irish) will now count toward the SEC's requirement of playing one nonconference Power 5 team per season, sources told ESPN.com.Beginning in 2016, the SEC will require its league members to play at least one nonconference Power 5 team. Notre Dame had always been included as a nonconference Power 5 team by the SEC, but the league recently decided to also allow games against BYU and Army to count, sources said.
The SEC and ACC are the only Power 5 leagues that require their league members to play at least one nonconference Power 5 opponent. In January, the ACC changed its stance to allow games against BYU to count toward its requirement. However, games against Army will not count toward the ACC's requirement, a source said.
While the SEC will require its league members to play at least one nonconference Power 5 team starting in 2016, the ACC's requirement doesn't begin until 2017.
Like the ACC, the SEC had a change in philosophy on counting games against BYU toward its nonconference Power 5 commitment.

[DrumNFeather]

Big10 will count BYU as P5 for scheduling. That makes all of the P5 conferences, I think.

Obviously, this is good news for BYU scheduling. They ought to be able to arrange 3-5 P5 games per year. I imagine their home schedules will benefit, as more P5 teams will agree to 1-1 deals. I don't know if their November schedule is ever going to be good, though.

It's hard for me to imagine a scenario where the argument for a team getting in to that 4th spot over another ends up being "but they beat BYU."

[sancho]

It's hard for me to imagine a scenario where the argument for a team getting in to that 4th spot over another ends up being "but they beat BYU."

It's not the playoff contenders that will want to schedule BYU. It's the weak P5 teams, looking for an OOC schedule that can help them get to a bowl game. They'll call Kansas and Rutgers first, but BYU won't be too far down the list.

Isn't this how the SEC changed their mind on BYU? One of the Mississippi teams wanted a weak OOC schedule and convinced the rest of the conference to count their BYU game as fulfilling the P5 requirement? My memory is fuzzy on this, but I think something like that happened?

[tooblue]

It's not the playoff contenders that will want to schedule BYU. It's the weak P5 teams, looking for an OOC schedule that can help them get to a bowl game.

Like Utah.

[Scratch]

Like Utah.

Except for the fact that Utah is like 14-1 or something like that in non-conference games since joining the P12, including being undefeated against non-P12 P5 teams during that stretch.

[sancho]

Like Utah.

Didn't work so well for Michigan. If they had picked a worse P5 - BYU for example - they would have gone bowling.

Utah is in a no man's land for P5 scheduling right now. The weak teams don't want to add us because we are too good. The power programs don't want to add us because we are not good enough. It's a problem.

[tooblue]

Except for the fact that Utah is like 14-1 or something like that in non-conference games since joining the P12, including being undefeated against non-P12 P5 teams during that stretch.

Did Utah finally get back to a bowl last season?

[tooblue]

Didn't work so well for Michigan. If they had picked a worse P5 - BYU for example - they would have gone bowling.

Utah is in a no man's land for P5 scheduling right now. The weak teams don't want to add us because we are too good. The power programs don't want to add us because we are not good enough. It's a problem.

I was at the Michigan v Utah game ... there was no way Michigan was going bowling regardless.

[Scorcho]

Did the SEC change their mine? They had original said they would not count BYU as a P5, but I haven't paid attention lately.

Yep, and Army, rumor is the SEC are still debating the Coast Guard.

[Scratch]

I was at the Michigan v Utah game ... there was no way Michigan was going bowling regardless.

Wait, you're saying a 6-6 Michigan team wouldn't have gone to a bowl? I know you're trying to troll here, but this is an incredibly weak trolling effort.

[Scorcho]

Wait, you're saying a 6-6 Michigan team wouldn't have gone to a bowl? I know you're trying to troll here, but this is an incredibly weak trolling effort.

Defeating a 6-6 Michigan Team is no small feat ask that 1984 BYU Team :)

[tooblue]

Defeating a 6-6 Michigan Team is no small feat ask that 1984 BYU Team :)

You're bringing up 1984? :rofl:

[Scorcho]

You're bringing up 1984? :rofl:

wasn't 1984 the pinnacle of BYU Athletics? (Not defeating a team in the top 50 and getting a national championship out of it). the Y fans I know speak of it with solemn reverence and great pride.

[LA Ute]

wasn't 1984 the pinnacle of BYU Athletics? (Not defeating a team in the top 50 and getting a national championship out of it). the Y fans I know speak of it with solemn reverence and great pride.

It was a sacred time and a sacred achievement. No rational or righteous person may deride it.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[sancho]

It was a sacred time and a sacred achievement. No rational or righteous person may deride it.



It led to the BCS system, which led to Utah entering the Pac12, which led to BYU going independent, which led to Bronco and Holmoe begging the Big12 for admission, which led to nothing. So yeah, 1984 ain't so bad in the long run.

[NorthwestUteFan]

It led to the BCS system, which led to Utah entering the Pac12, which led to BYU going independent, which led to Bronco and Holmoe begging the Big12 for admission, which led to nothing. So yeah, 1984 ain't so bad in the long run.

When you put it that way, 1984 was awesome! That was the gift that keeps on giving for time and for all eternity.

[LA Ute]

It led to the BCS system, which led to Utah entering the Pac12, which led to BYU going independent, which led to Bronco and Holmoe begging the Big12 for admission, which led to nothing. So yeah, 1984 ain't so bad in the long run.

I see the hand of Providence at work.

[tooblue]

I see the hand of Providence at work.

It’s remarkable in contrasts: what one program can accomplish, in changing the very landscape and nature of a sports culture. As compared to another program, which can only ever hope to reap the benefits of that culture, through no fault of their own.

And I guess it’s even more significant if you consider the place it holds in your collective Psyches. Truth be told, I’ve moved on. But if ya’ll can’t let it go, then have at it.

Utah, the new Alabama (or the baby boomers of College football)!

[Ma'ake]

It’s remarkable in contrasts: what one program can accomplish, in changing the very landscape and nature of a sports culture. As compared to another program, which can only ever hope to reap the benefits of that culture, through no fault of their own.

And I guess it’s even more significant if you consider the place it holds in your collective Psyches. Truth be told, I’ve moved on. But if ya’ll can’t let it go, then have at it.

Utah, the new Alabama (or the baby boomers of College football)!

What BYU fans are going through is a lot more intense than the normal college fan roller coaster.

The pressure that has come to bear on BYU, expectations to impress the CFB world by slaying P5 opponents and stand out on the national stage, combined with stagnation/mediocrity in the football product, is resulting in really thoughtful, seasoned fans jumping off the ship, in public ways.

[tooblue]

What BYU fans are going through is a lot more intense than the normal college fan roller coaster.

The pressure that has come to bear on BYU, expectations to impress the CFB world by slaying P5 opponents and stand out on the national stage, combined with stagnation/mediocrity in the football product, is resulting in really thoughtful, seasoned fans jumping off the ship, in public ways.

I'm not certain you are directing this at me, but I haven't jumped ship. I am looking forward to this season and watching BYU. In contrast, I'm somewhat indifferent about Utah's upcoming season. I think they should do better than finish 5th in their division. But, maybe not.

[NorthwestUteFan]

I'm not certain you are directing this at me, but I haven't jumped ship. I am looking forward to this season and watching BYU. In contrast, I'm somewhat indifferent about Utah's upcoming season. I think they should do better than finish 5th in their division. But, maybe not.

Meh. 5th in the South last year (with a #21 finish in the season-ending polls, mind you) would have been good enough for #2 in the North.

Meanwhile your team might have finished just behind CSU in the MWC and, well, you know how overmatched the Rams were in the Veg Bowl.

Good hell. Your team can't even win the post-game brawls they start.

[NorthwestUteFan]

In fact you should be thrilled you live outside* of Utah. The BYU of Provo isn't doing much of anything to help out the home crowd. I mean, seriously, playing Wagner late in the season? The Provo crowd has to be pissed off. Those who travel to Lincoln and Ann Arbor will be treated to two of the greatest game-day environments in all of sports.

*speaking seriously for a moment, Toronto is one of the great cities of the world. That would be a fantastic place to live.

[NorthwestUteFan]

Utah, the new Alabama (or the baby boomers of College football)!

When you reference Alabama, is that in a the 'marry your 14 year-old cousin' sense? Because the National Brand of Brigham Young would seem to be more appropriate in that sense...

[U-Ute]

There is a rumor going around that someone hacked Holmoe's Twitter account and tweeted that BYU was in the Big12. I have a screen pic, but it isn't dated and just has a "5h" time stamp.

Did that actually happen? Think of all of the ruined ankle socks.

[Brian]

Yes, the lord uses the small and simple things to bring forth his great work.

[Brian]

When you reference Alabama, is that in a the 'marry your 14 year-old cousin' sense? Because the National Brand of Brigham Young would seem to be more appropriate in that sense...

Pleas be respectful. It's not Brigham young, it's division one football team.

[SoCalPat]

It's hard for me to imagine a scenario where the argument for a team getting in to that 4th spot over another ends up being "but they beat BYU."

It's not that. It's that the argument will be "but they played BYU and not a FCS team ..."

[SoCalPat]

I think it's a little early to start digging the grave for the psyche of the BYU fan. The Nebraska game is winnable, and Boise State was run wild on by Air Force and UNM's option attacks. What do you think Taysom Hill will do to that defense?

The schedule says they'll finish 6-6, but if they can beat Nebraska, a 9- or 10-win season becomes their new ceiling. And we all know BYU is a leading contender in the Frontrunner Top 25 Poll every year.

[LA Ute]

It’s remarkable in contrasts: what one program can accomplish, in changing the very landscape and nature of a sports culture. As compared to another program, which can only ever hope to reap the benefits of that culture, through no fault of their own.

And I guess it’s even more significant if you consider the place it holds in your collective Psyches. Truth be told, I’ve moved on. But if ya’ll can’t let it go, then have at it.

Utah, the new Alabama (or the baby boomers of College football)!

The Y was an Elias for us. A noble role.

As for you, my friend, I'm glad you've moved on. That makes it all the more touching that you, who no longer care about the rivalry, still care enough about us to come here and chat about these things. ;)


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[NorthwestUteFan]

Pleas be respectful. It's not Brigham young, it's division one football team.

DOFT for short.

[Dwight Schr-Ute]

There is a rumor going around that someone hacked Holmoe's Twitter account and tweeted that BYU was in the Big12. I have a screen pic, but it isn't dated and just has a "5h" time stamp.

Did that actually happen? Think of all of the ruined ankle socks.

It looked like a marginal photoshop job to me.

[Dwight Schr-Ute]

Yes, the lord uses the small and simple things to bring forth his great work.


DOFT for short.

:high five:

[tooblue]

BYU's Taysom Hill understands risk and reward better than most
http://www.usatoday.com/story/sports/ncaaf/independents/2015/08/02/taysom-hill-byu-quarterback-venture-capital/30997325/ (http://www.usatoday.com/story/sports/ncaaf/independents/2015/08/02/taysom-hill-byu-quarterback-venture-capital/30997325/)

[Solon]

BYU's Taysom Hill understands risk and reward better than most
http://www.usatoday.com/story/sports/ncaaf/independents/2015/08/02/taysom-hill-byu-quarterback-venture-capital/30997325/ (http://www.usatoday.com/story/sports/ncaaf/independents/2015/08/02/taysom-hill-byu-quarterback-venture-capital/30997325/)
good for him. Here's a kid who knows that there is life after football

Sounds like he is learning the Mormon gospel of wealth very well.

[U-Ute]

I just got a text that Jamaal Williams is leaving BYU.

That's going to hurt.

[chrisrenrut]

I just got a text that Jamaal Williams is leaving BYU.

That's going to hurt.

Nah, king Taysom will just be jumping over lines of scrimmage anyways. Just one less person to get in the way ��

[UtahsMrSports]

ByuTV had a replay of the Harline game yesterday. Man, we were bad that year on offense that year.

Its amazing how close we are to having won the rivalry game every year since 96!

[Ma'ake]

ByuTV had a replay of the Harline game yesterday. Man, we were bad that year on offense that year.

Its amazing how close we are to having won the rivalry game every year since 96!

The fact they haven't blown us off the field since 96 is a source of great angst among their more rational fans. They're in an odd place, for them. Plenty of Big-12 chatter, but also a sense that the football product is stuck in a tier of mediocrity. The hope seems to be if they get into the Big-12, top tier LDS recruits will start going to BYU, but then Jamaal Williams happens, and the conversation goes to why the honor code needs to be altered, quite a bit.

I've gotten to the point where I don't care if they get into the Big-12, though the Sunday play issue would be interesting to see play out, and a football-only invite is a "Mickey Mouse league" idea, according to Barry Trammel, one of BYU's biggest advocates as the Big-12 internal struggles play out in public.

If BYU's in the Big-12, the rivalry gets a stent, but then they realize they're still in an unenviable position because the Big-12 is so dysfunctional, and there's just no way to equate Big-12 destinations with any PAC-12 venues, excluding Texas and Pullman.

[NorthwestUteFan]

But if they join the Big XII the dozens of Mormons in Pittsburgh can drive to Morgantown every other year to watch a game.

And Texas will cry, because Austin wants so badly to be a California city.

[Dwight Schr-Ute]

ByuTV had a replay of the Harline game yesterday. Man, we were bad that year on offense that year.

Its amazing how close we are to having won the rivalry game every year since 96!

Evidenced by how much we gave the ball to a DB on offense.

[Dwight Schr-Ute]

This is cute.
http://images.tapatalk-cdn.com/15/08/09/2e097a022214fece8e960cc65becc8a3.jpg

[U-Ute]

http://images.tapatalk-cdn.com/15/08/09/5607139a3d6935e5b23a79715eb6cb10.jpg

[LA Ute]

ByuTV had a replay of the Harline game yesterday. Man, we were bad that year on offense that year.

Its amazing how close we are to having won the rivalry game every year since 96!

Go easy on them. In the last 12 years they've won only 3 games. They haven't got many replays to show these days.

[sancho]

I've gotten to the point where I don't care if they get into the Big-12

This is just something Utah fans say to soften the blow in case it ever actually happens. Truth is, we all care. It would hurt us, and it would breathe new life into their dying program.

[UtahsMrSports]

Go easy on them. In the last 12 years they've won only 3 games. They haven't got many replays to show these days.

Its actually kind of amazing to think that since 1992, they have beat us 3 times in Provo.

[Viking]

http://images.tapatalk-cdn.com/15/08/09/5607139a3d6935e5b23a79715eb6cb10.jpg

DDD in the middle 22 yrs ago if it were straight outta TO or Cochabamba

[LA Ute]

DDD in the middle 22 yrs ago if it were straight outta TO or Cochabamba

You knew him then?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Viking]

He lived across the street from me and was a frequent visitor at our apt. He was a good guy back then. That of course isn't him in the pic but not too far off (several decades ago)

[Ma'ake]

This is just something Utah fans say to soften the blow in case it ever actually happens. Truth is, we all care. It would hurt us, and it would breathe new life into their dying program.

I guess I don't fear them getting into the Big-12 as much as I enjoy watching them suffer. We'd be OK. Stanford might suffer, we might suffer a little, but assuming Dennis Erickson isn't the only coach recruiting Florida, and we continue to establish a respectable PAC product, we'd be fine.

I catch myself thinking about the reasons they would get stiffed again, and then I think "why should I care? We're getting respect in our own league, Utah being in the PAC is gratifying enough, on it's own." And, it is.

Sigh... good thing we don't play again this year. More detox needed... :)

[LA Ute]

I guess I don't fear them getting into the Big-12 as much as I enjoy watching them suffer. We'd be OK. Stanford might suffer, we might suffer a little, but assuming Dennis Erickson isn't the only coach recruiting Florida, and we continue to establish a respectable PAC product, we'd be fine.

I catch myself thinking about the reasons they would get stiffed again, and then I think "why should I care? We're getting respect in our own league, Utah being in the PAC is gratifying enough, on it's own." And, it is.

Sigh... good thing we don't play again this year. More detox needed... :)

I don't care if they get in a P5 conference or not. Doing so would enhance their ability to get LDS players, so I guess that could be detrimental to Utah's fortunes. Other than that, meh. We'd occasionally have to listen to and read rhapsodic descriptions of how extraordinary their new league is and how the new affiliation is a sign of something deeply significant that it surely isn't. But that's just life in the neighborhood.


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[sancho]

I don't care if they get in a P5 conference or not. Doing so would enhance their ability to get LDS players, so I guess that could be detrimental to Utah's fortunes. Other than that, meh. We'd occasionally have to listen to and read rhapsodic descriptions of how extraordinary their new league is and how the new affiliation is a sign of something deeply significant that it surely isn't. But that's just life in the neighborhood.



I guess I don't fear them getting into the Big-12 as much as I enjoy watching them suffer. We'd be OK. Stanford might suffer, we might suffer a little, but assuming Dennis Erickson isn't the only coach recruiting Florida, and we continue to establish a respectable PAC product, we'd be fine.

I catch myself thinking about the reasons they would get stiffed again, and then I think "why should I care? We're getting respect in our own league, Utah being in the PAC is gratifying enough, on it's own." And, it is.

You both admit that a P5 for BYU would hurt us in terms of recruiting. So of course we care. Maybe we aren't losing sleep over it, but every one of us would vote against BYU to the Big12.

A fresh start in a P5 is a dangerous thing. If you happen to have the ball bounce your way and light it up in year one, the momentum swing is tremendous. We had that chance, and it didn't really happen for us. I don't want BYU to have that chance. But even if they are like us and don't capitalize in year 1 or 2, they still get a recruiting benefit.

Our success depends heavily on being able to get the best from the state of Utah. We will not become Pac-12 contenders based on 2-3 Florida kids per year.

But I get what you are saying, it wouldn't be the end of the world, and there wouldn't be all that much weeping, wailing, or gnashing of teeth.

Order:

Utah in/BYU out >> Utah in / BYU in >>>>> Utah out / BYU out

No matter what happens to BYU, Utah is in a much better spot than we were in the MWC.

[LA Ute]

You both admit that a P5 for BYU would hurt us in terms of recruiting. So of course we care. Maybe we aren't losing sleep over it, but every one of us would vote against BYU to the Big12.

A fresh start in a P5 is a dangerous thing. If you happen to have the ball bounce your way and light it up in year one, the momentum swing is tremendous. We had that chance, and it didn't really happen for us. I don't want BYU to have that chance. But even if they are like us and don't capitalize in year 1 or 2, they still get a recruiting benefit.

Our success depends heavily on being able to get the best from the state of Utah. We will not become Pac-12 contenders based on 2-3 Florida kids per year.

But I get what you are saying, it wouldn't be the end of the world, and there wouldn't be all that much weeping, wailing, or gnashing of teeth.

Order:

Utah in/BYU out >> Utah in / BYU in >>>>> Utah out / BYU out

No matter what happens to BYU, Utah is in a much better spot than we were in the MWC.

You and I agree. What I am saying is that ultimately what happens with BYU is out of our control, and I like where we are. I love where we are.

[Ma'ake]

You both admit that a P5 for BYU would hurt us in terms of recruiting. So of course we care. Maybe we aren't losing sleep over it, but every one of us would vote against BYU to the Big12.

A fresh start in a P5 is a dangerous thing. If you happen to have the ball bounce your way and light it up in year one, the momentum swing is tremendous. We had that chance, and it didn't really happen for us. I don't want BYU to have that chance. But even if they are like us and don't capitalize in year 1 or 2, they still get a recruiting benefit.

Our success depends heavily on being able to get the best from the state of Utah. We will not become Pac-12 contenders based on 2-3 Florida kids per year.

But I get what you are saying, it wouldn't be the end of the world, and there wouldn't be all that much weeping, wailing, or gnashing of teeth.

No matter what happens to BYU, Utah is in a much better spot than we were in the MWC.

Stanford and USC are the ones eating more into a recruiting base we assumed we'd have the upper hand vs BYU. (Stanford is likewise manhandling BYU for that segment of players.)

We've all adjusted to serious intra-PAC recruiting competition, and if anyone thinks Utah will regularly clean up on in-state recruiting, I want some of what they're smoking. But some of these kids certainly want to play at high-level P5 programs AND leave home, so it's hard to say how much we can stop the bleeding of talented in state players leaving, even if we fight up into the top half of the PAC-12 South.

I think it's fair to say Utah fans thought we'd be taking a sizable leap up in getting highly recruited kids, and it hasn't materialized as quickly and to the extent many thought. We may move up in that regard, but serious kudos have to be given to the staff for blending a "diamond-in-the-rough" strategy with a modest bump up in getting highly rated recruits, like Kylie Fitts (on a transfer, granted) and Cory Butler... both 4 star recruits. I think we all take recruiting stars with a grain of salt (Langi and Fehoko), so the recruiting rankings just don't hurt.

For BYU, if they get into the Big-12, I think they get more good LDS talent, unquestionably, but the honor code will continue to haunt them - to a significant extent, but not completely - even if they make the jump up.

And I'm starting to think the Big-12 may yet disintegrate. Geez, what a dysfunctional spectacle that conference is. They apparently don't care about the academic stature of Boise, and now the internal conference business is being conducted using Twitter, Columnists, rogue University Presidents (Boren at OU) and who knows what other tangential lines of communication and exertion of pressure. Nebraska is right. The Big-12 is a joke. If they invite BYU for football only, it's just another example, and if they invite BYU for all sports and force everyone else to adjust non-FB schedules, it's yet another example.

[Dwight Schr-Ute]

My biggest consternation about them to the Big-12 is that they'd get stuck in the northern division with the likes of Iowa State, Kansas and Kansas State making their transition much easier than ours. I'm all about limiting any possibility they have to puff their chests, regardless of the ridiculousness of the claim.

Now BYU to the Big 5 conference would be something I could get behind.

[sancho]

My biggest consternation about them to the Big-12 is that they'd get stuck in the northern division with the likes of Iowa State, Kansas and Kansas State making their transition much easier than ours.

Yeah, it would be like Wisconsin in the Big10 or GT in the ACC. Conference championship games all the time while better teams in the Pac12 and SEC are finishing under .500 in conference play.

[NorthwestUteFan]

Yeah, it would be like Wisconsin in the Big10 or GT in the ACC. Conference championship games all the time while better teams in the Pac12 and SEC are finishing under .500 in conference play.

Isn't that the truth. Nebraska was in the same situation. 9-10 wins per year without breaking much of a sweat.

It almost seems the ACC and Big XVII are in a race to decide who will blow up first. If either of them fold then we will see a major restructuring of the football map. Perhaps we will see 16-team leagues. I do not like that idea, especially since that puts Utah in some Mountain/Plains division. Yuck.

If byu-Provo going to Big XVII will provide some stability, then so be it. If Oklahoma bolts for B1G and Texas comes a-courtin' the PAC, then we will be in for a rough ride.

Either way they will tout the Honor Code as proof of their superiority right up until the point at which it causes them troubles in the football field.

[Scratch]

BYU to the B12 would hurt us a bit in recruiting, but the biggest thing Utah has to gain by BYU's continued slide into mediocrity is dominance of the state. There is a lot to be gained by having Utah establish itself completely as not just the biggest show in the state, but the only high-level program. The increase in fans and support would be extremely valuable to the athletic department's bottom line. With only the Jazz to compete against and a rapidly growing population, we'd be looking at sold-out Huntsman centers and football demand that would easily support significant growth.

[sancho]

BYU to the B12 would hurt us a bit in recruiting, but the biggest thing Utah has to gain by BYU's continued slide into mediocrity is dominance of the state. There is a lot to be gained by having Utah establish itself completely as not just the biggest show in the state, but the only high-level program. The increase in fans and support would be extremely valuable to the athletic department's bottom line. With only the Jazz to compete against and a rapidly growing population, we'd be looking at sold-out Huntsman centers and football demand that would easily support significant growth.

That's the dream. How cool would it be to have an undivided state?

[LA Ute]

Kragthorpe: Wrong about BYU and Utah, that one time (http://www.sltrib.com/sports/2822033-155/kragthorpe-wrong-about-byu-and-utah?fullpage=1)
"My Tribune anniversary this week forces me to look back and, as with anyone involved in sports, I tend to dwell on the ones I'd like to do over. Like declaring in the summer of 2010 that BYU's bold move into football independence gave the Cougars "a draw" with Utah's Pac-12 invitation.
"Wow. Five years later, how silly do those words appear?"

[DrumNFeather]

Kragthorpe: Wrong about BYU and Utah, that one time (http://www.sltrib.com/sports/2822033-155/kragthorpe-wrong-about-byu-and-utah?fullpage=1)


"My Tribune anniversary this week forces me to look back and, as with anyone involved in sports, I tend to dwell on the ones I'd like to do over. Like declaring in the summer of 2010 that BYU's bold move into football independence gave the Cougars "a draw" with Utah's Pac-12 invitation.
"Wow. Five years later, how silly do those words appear?"

"Yet there's no question that Utah is in another realm than it was before, and BYU is in an awkward stage. Five years later, that's the conclusion I would draw."

[Ma'ake]

This will get a reaction...

http://www.deseretnews.com/article/865634648/It-takes-a-special-type-of-school-to-get-invited-into-Pac-12.html

[sancho]

[SIZE=2]This will get a reaction

That's what it was published for.

I think the author was the institute director at the u while I was a student?

He/we can talk about graduate programs all day long; it's the two bcs wins that got us in.

[Ma'ake]

That's what it was published for.

I think the author was the institute director at the u while I was a student?

He/we can talk about graduate programs all day long; it's the two bcs wins that got us in.

I think both PAC constituencies - Athletics and Academics - were impressed enough with Utah to merit an invitation. We had solid alignment in both.

I first thought Utah and CU would be good PAC candidates in 2008, for the variety of reasons. It's as big of impact for the U as the opening of the Med School, and benefits the State of Utah, as well.

We'll see what happens with TV cord-cutting, but a couple of sleeper candidates schools for expansion - assuming Texas and OU don't decide to look west - might be Hawai'i and UNLV (who just opened their Med School, believe it or not). This would be 20 years down the road, or so. Hawai'i would be a gateway to expanding mindshare into Asia, along the lines of the PAC-12 basketball all-stars going to China.

The academic angle would be key in reaching out across the Pacific, as universities become more interconnected and online, and less about bricks and mortar.

[SoCalPat]

That's what it was published for.

I think the author was the institute director at the u while I was a student?

He/we can talk about graduate programs all day long; it's the two bcs wins that got us in.

Boise State still being in the MWC makes this an entirely useless and invalid argument.

[LA Ute]

This will get a reaction...

http://www.deseretnews.com/article/865634648/It-takes-a-special-type-of-school-to-get-invited-into-Pac-12.html


Loved the comments. It is gospel among BYU fans that Utah got in as a last minute desperation measure by Scott, because it was acceptably non-religious. Whatever makes them feel better.

[sancho]

Boise State still being in the MWC makes this an entirely useless and invalid argument.

If Utah had no med school and a worse academic profile, we would still have been invited.

If Utah had never won a BCS game, we would not have been invited.

I did not say that a BCS win would get any team into a P5. I only said that our two BCS wins got us in, and they did. Those wins made us a candidate, and our growing media market and proximity to Colorado sealed the deal.

[sancho]

Loved the comments. It is gospel among BYU fans that Utah got in as a last minute desperation measure by Scott, because it was acceptably non-religious. Whatever makes them feel better.

What's crazy is that there is a growing number of Utah fans who are accepting this explanation.

[Scorcho]

Loved the comments. It is gospel among BYU fans that Utah got in as a last minute desperation measure by Scott, because it was acceptably non-religious. Whatever makes them feel better.

the author of this article, Paul Browning got his:

B.S. - San Diego St

Masters - BYU

PHD - UCLA

[LA Ute]

What's crazy is that there is a growing number of Utah fans who are accepting this explanation.

That is sad. You would think that people would at least be skeptical of a narrative that is so perfect for making BYU look like the wronged party in this case, and for diminishing Utah's accomplishment. It's just too perfect for BYU to be credible.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[U-Ute]

If Utah had no med school and a worse academic profile, we would still have been invited.

If Utah had never won a BCS game, we would not have been invited.

I think you take out either and we don't get invited.

[sancho]

I think you take out either and we don't get invited.

So, you think they stay at 10? Or they invite CU + someone else? Who else? It was either Utah or Boise, and we added much more value. They'd have plugged their noses and invited us. It's a great bonus to the Pac-12 that Utah is strong academically.

[DrumNFeather]

That is sad. You would think that people would at least be skeptical of a narrative that is so perfect for making BYU look like the wronged party in this case, and for diminishing Utah's accomplishment. It's just too perfect for BYU to be credible.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Who cares what narrative BYU fans push? They believe in angels and gold bibles and stuff. I mean...that's just crazy AMIRIGHT?

[concerned]

Actually, I like the Y narrative. Doesn't bother me if we got in thru the most fortuitous circumstances possible and we really didn't deserve it. I like it because it drives them even more crazy and gnaws at them all the more. I hope they stew about it 24/7/365.

[U-Ute]

Has anyone heard of JonRaheem Peoples? Apparently he had some Twitter spam/rant disparaging BYU that he has since delete.

Is it a case of sour grapes?

[UtahsMrSports]

Has anyone heard of JonRaheem Peoples? Apparently he had some Twitter spam/rant disparaging BYU that he has since delete.

Is it a case of sour grapes?

Lol. That dude is the most legendary non factors in recent memory.

A few years ago, he committed to BYU but later visited us. On his visit, he committed, which caused Brandon Gurney to go on a childish rant about how Utah just copies byu in recruiting, he was madddd!

Later that night, peoples re committed to the Y and Gurney then deleted his article on desnews.com and rewrote a typical gurney article for a byu commit.

On signing day or close to it, peoples made one of those cute videos where he burned a U.

He washed out at the Y, be it academics or otherwise i cant remember. He begged for a Utah offer and then ended up at Idaho st. Thats the last ive heard.

[Scratch]

Has anyone heard of JonRaheem Peoples? Apparently he had some Twitter spam/rant disparaging BYU that he has since delete.

Is it a case of sour grapes?


Here you go, if you care:

Byu is a cult they try an hide up everything wrong they be doing. All of them can break honor code 24/7 but I get eligble more $% pops up

been grinding did everything I needed they just want more money don't want me 2 be succsesfull, full of fakes

This is to funny if any media wants to expose byu for their illegal actions they be doing I got the 411. Trying 2 hold me back 4 no reason

good question. 1 they lie to u on the visit they tell u it's one way when it's not. So basically was tricked 2 go

[Rocker Ute]

Here you go, if you care:

Byu is a cult they try an hide up everything wrong they be doing. All of them can break honor code 24/7 but I get eligble more $% pops up

been grinding did everything I needed they just want more money don't want me 2 be succsesfull, full of fakes

This is to funny if any media wants to expose byu for their illegal actions they be doing I got the 411. Trying 2 hold me back 4 no reason

good question. 1 they lie to u on the visit they tell u it's one way when it's not. So basically was tricked 2 go

Took me a second to realize you were quoting Peoples. I thought maybe we were finally seeing the true Scratch.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[U-Ute]

Lol. That dude is the most legendary non factors in recent memory.

A few years ago, he committed to BYU but later visited us. On his visit, he committed, which caused Brandon Gurney to go on a childish rant about how Utah just copies byu in recruiting, he was madddd!

Later that night, peoples re committed to the Y and Gurney then deleted his article on desnews.com and rewrote a typical gurney article for a byu commit.

On signing day or close to it, peoples made one of those cute videos where he burned a U.

He washed out at the Y, be it academics or otherwise i cant remember. He begged for a Utah offer and then ended up at Idaho st. Thats the last ive heard.


Oh! I remember the tweet of a kid burning an offer letter. That was this kid? It seems like we really dodged a bullet on that kid.

[U-Ute]

Took me a second to realize you were quoting Peoples. I thought maybe we were finally seeing the true Scratch.

Have you ever seen Scratch and Peoples in a room together?

[Dwight Schr-Ute]

Oh! I remember the tweet of a kid burning an offer letter. That was this kid? It seems like we really dodged a bullet on that kid.

I think you're remembering this pudgy genius. Who's now at Oregon State, if I remember correctly! Yay! http://www.sbnation.com/ncaa-football/2012/6/12/3080897/byu-recruit-utah-letter-burned-brayden-kearsley

[UtahsMrSports]

Oh! I remember the tweet of a kid burning an offer letter. That was this kid? It seems like we really dodged a bullet on that kid.

That was Brayden Kearsley. Apparently, burning a U is what all the flameouts do, pun intended.

[U-Ute]

That was Brayden Kearsley. Apparently, burning a U is what all the flameouts do, pun intended.

Nice.


:rimshot:

[tooblue]

Less than three weeks to go, and this is the most active thread on this message board :rofl:

[DrumNFeather]

Less than three weeks to go, and this is the most active thread on this message board :rofl:

...that you know about. :cool:

[tooblue]

...that you know about. :cool:

LOL You're right. I forgot about those secret forums.

[Solon]

LOL You're right. I forgot about those secret forums.
fora.

[Dwight Schr-Ute]

fora.

Fora and fauna.